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Old August 17th, 2015, 08:01 PM   #21
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Oh, I know there are people who disagree with me, but I also think there are MORE people who believe that at some point in development, a fetus actually IS a person. Since the argument actually hasn't been won, I found it odd that you would be so forceful to say you were not going to let my "arbitrary" statement go unchallenged, as if I was in some tiny minority of people who unreasonably feel the way I do.
I would guess that the vast majority "that at some point in development, a fetus actually IS a person". I'm one of them.

I just don't think it's at the moment of conception. (I think it is around the 20-22 week point)
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Old August 17th, 2015, 08:32 PM   #22
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I did say those things. I did not say my side had won. I did not say that the opposition on either side was some tiny minority. Don't you even remember what you put in your own posts?
Of course I remember what I put in my posts. Do you?

I said, "That's quite a slippery slope when you start examining the "probability of an abysmal life" when determining who lives and who dies."
From that, you responded, ""No, the slippery slope is you arbitrarily deciding that a fetus is a person."
Where did I state that decision? I was actually arguing that an "abysmal life" is way too subjective to use as a reason for abortion, but you made the claim I was arguing "personhood." I never mentioned 'personhood," though, so I had no idea why you got so defensive, to the point of saying, "I have no idea why you don't just admit that you won't convince me." Now, even though I didn't specifically say "personhood," I can understand how personhood arguments could be inferred from the tenor of my post, but I hadn't made any specific claims about personhood for you to then say I was making an arbitrary decision about it.

Did you really think a statement of my opinion about "abysmal life" was was a refusal to admit that I can't convince you of personhood? You just sounded SOOO convinced of your own opinion that it sounded to me that you wanted me to just roll over and not say anything more about it. Granted, you didn't flat out tell me your side had won the countless previous arguments, but I simply inferred from your adamance that you believed your side was so much in the right that any opposition to it should be publicly challenged as being in the wrong.
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Old August 17th, 2015, 08:36 PM   #23
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the 10 y/o in the title of this thread is in Paraguay, not the US. I doubt anyone here would want a 10 y/o rape victim to suffer through a pregnancy and delivery that might kill her. the scumbag that raped her needs to be castrated asap!
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Old August 17th, 2015, 08:37 PM   #24
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I would guess that the vast majority "that at some point in development, a fetus actually IS a person". I'm one of them.

I just don't think it's at the moment of conception. (I think it is around the 20-22 week point)
I wonder if RNG is going to tell YOU that you are "arbitrarily deciding that a fetus is a person."
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Old August 17th, 2015, 09:08 PM   #25
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Of course I remember what I put in my posts. Do you?

I said, "That's quite a slippery slope when you start examining the "probability of an abysmal life" when determining who lives and who dies."
From that, you responded, ""No, the slippery slope is you arbitrarily deciding that a fetus is a person."
Where did I state that decision? I was actually arguing that an "abysmal life" is way too subjective to use as a reason for abortion, but you made the claim I was arguing "personhood." I never mentioned 'personhood," though, so I had no idea why you got so defensive, to the point of saying, "I have no idea why you don't just admit that you won't convince me." Now, even though I didn't specifically say "personhood," I can understand how personhood arguments could be inferred from the tenor of my post, but I hadn't made any specific claims about personhood for you to then say I was making an arbitrary decision about it.

Did you really think a statement of my opinion about "abysmal life" was was a refusal to admit that I can't convince you of personhood? You just sounded SOOO convinced of your own opinion that it sounded to me that you wanted me to just roll over and not say anything more about it. Granted, you didn't flat out tell me your side had won the countless previous arguments, but I simply inferred from your adamance that you believed your side was so much in the right that any opposition to it should be publicly challenged as being in the wrong.
You said that aborting the fetus is killing a person. You did not define at what stage.

You also appear to be supporting this decision to refuse this child an abortion. Twist and turn all you want, those positions are wrong, IMO.
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Old August 17th, 2015, 10:02 PM   #26
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You said that aborting the fetus is killing a person. You did not define at what stage.
Now who is the one claiming things are said that haven't been said. You talked about "the person this fetus might develop into" as someone who would go hungry. I just asked you if you felt death was a better option. You mentioned "Excising a clump of cells before it has a chance to become a person who has a very great probability of an abysmal life." I then started arguing the "abysmal life" part. I didn't argue the "personhood" part, so you can't show me any post where I specifically said "aborting the fetus is killing a person." I only started talking about personhood, and whether the fetus was a person, due to your insistence that the conversation go in that direction. I didn't bring it up.

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You also appear to be supporting this decision to refuse this child an abortion.
I don't know where you are getting this assumption. Arguing against your "abysmal life" statement is not the same as supporting the decision to refuse this child an abortion.

Last edited by Bookworm; August 17th, 2015 at 10:06 PM.
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Old August 17th, 2015, 10:16 PM   #27
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although I think purvi patel's sentence was a bit harsh, she did throw a LIVE baby in a dumpster and then lied to doctors at the hospital. I don't have a whole lot of sympathy for anyone who would throw a baby in a dumpster like it was trash.
i was with you up until here.

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if she didn't want the stigma of being an unwed mother she should have kept her damn legs shut
or used contraception, or used a morning after pill, or condoms, or had an abortion at 6 weeks. abstinence works, but so do other things.
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Old August 17th, 2015, 10:22 PM   #28
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I wonder if RNG is going to tell YOU that you are "arbitrarily deciding that a fetus is a person."
its not arbitrary. 20-24 weeks (everyone is different) is when the foetal brain starts producing activity that can be considered alive. prior to that the brain is living tissue sure, but it isnt a working brain. and a working functional brain is an absolute requirement for a human being to be considered alive. this point in development isnt "arbitrary".
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Old August 18th, 2015, 10:03 AM   #29
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i was with you up until here.



or used contraception, or used a morning after pill, or condoms, or had an abortion at 6 weeks. abstinence works, but so do other things.
yes those things too! with cheap birth control so easy to get I don't understand these women that play Russian roulette with their baby makers!
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Old August 18th, 2015, 05:21 PM   #30
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yes those things too! with cheap birth control so easy to get I don't understand these women that play Russian roulette with their baby makers!
the reason might be because they have had rubbish sex education by people who focussed on abstinence and ignored the reality of young peoples libidos.
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