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Old September 24th, 2008, 04:58 AM   #1
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An honest Pro-Abortionist

Camile Paglia's recent commentary at Salon.com provided the following quote:



Quote:
"I have always frankly admitted that abortion is murder, the extermination of the powerless by the powerful which results in the annihilation of concrete individuals and not just clumps of insensate tissue."


The full article can be found here;



Camille Paglia on Sarah Palin's debut, John McCain's rebirth, and Barack Obama's tenuous position | Salon



I would like to ask the pro-abortionists on this site, if they agree or disagree with Ms. Paglia. Why? Does this change or shade your opinion on abortion in any way?



Keep in mind that Camile Paglia is not a conservative or a pro-life personality in any sense - quite the opposite.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 05:10 AM   #2
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I honestly do not care what Camile Paglia's position is on that. She is entitled to her own ideas and beliefs, but she knows well enough not to restrict other women to what someone else believes. No one has ever said that everyone has to believe that abortion is the right option for a woman, only that it is the individual woman's decision to make. You believe whatever you like, but do not assume that your belief is the only valid opinion for all women.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 05:39 AM   #3
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I am not asking you to conform to her beliefs. I am asking if they influence your opinion in any way.



Do you find it at all odd that the pro-abortion group can't even agree whether or not the unborn child is alive, or human?



What do you make of her assertion that abortion is the "..extermination of the powerless by the powerful"?
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Old September 24th, 2008, 05:57 AM   #4
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It is the same emotional rhetoric that's been around for years. No, her words have no effect whatsoever on my own opions. ANd Pro CHOICE does not mean Pro Abortion, regardless of what many so-called pro lofers claim. I personally would not chose abortion. That is ME. However, I am well aware of the fact that other women facing what appears on the surface as the same situation are going to have diferent internal factors to content with, and will not make the same choices I might. They shouldn't have to, either. One size does NOT fit all.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 06:40 AM   #5
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Camile Paglia's opinion in no way effects my ideas and opinions on the subject. I am a fully grown woman, and can decide for myself what I think and why.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 07:29 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccvasquez
I am not asking you to conform to her beliefs. I am asking if they influence your opinion in any way.



Nope.



Do you find it at all odd that the pro-abortion group can't even agree whether or not the unborn child is alive, or human?



Not at all. There are a great many things in this world that not everyone agrees on.



What do you make of her assertion that abortion is the "..extermination of the powerless by the powerful"?


I find it blatantly over obvious and an attempt to pander to emotion.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 07:37 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Catus Felidae
I find it blatantly over obvious and an attempt to pander to emotion.


Sort of like the the term "pro-abortionist", IMHO...
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Old September 24th, 2008, 09:38 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccvasquez
I am not asking you to conform to her beliefs. I am asking if they influence your opinion in any way.



Do you find it at all odd that the pro-abortion group can't even agree whether or not the unborn child is alive, or human?



What do you make of her assertion that abortion is the "..extermination of the powerless by the powerful"?




Her beliefs don't influence my opinion in any way.



I do not find it odd that PRO CHOICE people have different ideas about the conception of life, because we all agree on one thing, and that is the rights of the MOTHER trump the rights, if any at all, of the unborn.



I don't know of anyone who is pro-abortion who thinks it is a good idea; it is clearly a painful decision and one that I will never have to make since I do not have a womb.



The "PRO LIFE" side of this debate has always made the error of simplifying this topic.....which is clearly NOT a black and white one. The fact that people on the pro-choice side have varying opinions speaks well for us...that we are able to see the nuances of life's complex issues; I wish the other side would take a page from that book, and then maybe we could have some honest debate in this country instead of the phony outrage driven political machine that installs incompetent people like Sara Palin on the ticket simply because she is a staunch pro lifer.

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Old September 24th, 2008, 09:53 AM   #9
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Jesus Christ himself could write a hand writen letter, and deliver it on a chariot of fire to each of the pro abortionist here, telling them abortion is murder, and it wouldnt change their minds.
 
Old September 24th, 2008, 09:57 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grace
Jesus Christ himself could write a hand writen letter, and deliver it on a chariot of fire to each of the pro abortionist here, telling them abortion is murder, and it wouldnt change their minds.




You are absolutely correct.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 10:07 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grace
Jesus Christ himself could write a hand writen letter, and deliver it on a chariot of fire to each of the pro abortionist here, telling them abortion is murder, and it wouldnt change their minds.


First he would have to find someone who is pro-abortion. I have never met any such person.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 11:04 AM   #12
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Grace, I think you might not agree with Jesus if you met him today, and didn't know it was him.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 11:22 AM   #13
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Thanks for the response Bronwyn,



Quote:
I personally would not chose abortion. That is ME. However, I am well aware of the fact that other women facing what appears on the surface as the same situation are going to have diferent internal factors to content with, and will not make the same choices I might. They shouldn't have to, either. One size does NOT fit all.


Do you believe that no moral decision is "black and white"? In other words, there is no moral issue that should ever be automatically rejected (or accepted)?
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Old September 24th, 2008, 11:25 AM   #14
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Waitingtables,



Thanks for responding.



Quote:
Camile Paglia's opinion in no way effects my ideas and opinions on the subject. I am a fully grown woman, and can decide for myself what I think and why.


I don't disagree that you are perfectly capable of making your own decisions and judgements.



Since you are not influenced by Ms. Paglia, what or who does influence you? Or have you come to your opinions based on your own independant research and education?
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Old September 24th, 2008, 11:43 AM   #15
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I have come to my own conclusions based on my life's experience and my own research. What influences me are the things that I have observed in my lifetime. And the situations that I watched people deal with.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 11:51 AM   #16
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Catus Filedae,



Thanks for responding.



Quote:
I find it blatantly over obvious and an attempt to pander to emotion.


For what purpose do you think Ms. Paglia is pandering to emotion? The point of her writing was not an endorsement of the pro-life position.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 01:23 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccvasquez
Catus Filedae,



Thanks for responding.



You're welcome.







For what purpose do you think Ms. Paglia is pandering to emotion? The point of her writing was not an endorsement of the pro-life position.


Considering that I do not personally know Ms. Pagila, I have no basis upon which to form an opinion as to her motives.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 02:05 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccvasquez
Thanks for the response Bronwyn,







Do you believe that no moral decision is "black and white"? In other words, there is no moral issue that should ever be automatically rejected (or accepted)?
So far, I have not seen any truly black and white issues. Morals are not consistant from one culture to another, one faith to another, one era to another.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 03:56 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccvasquez
I am not asking you to conform to her beliefs. I am asking if they influence your opinion in any way.
Influence my opinion? Not one iota.



Quote:
Do you find it at all odd that the pro-abortion group can't even agree whether or not the unborn child is alive, or human?
Nobody is "pro-abortion." They believe in the right of women to make their own decisions regarding the fetus in their body. Those who are pro-CHOICE don't care whether a woman chooses parenthood, adoption or abortion......just as long as the choice remains with the pregnant woman.



Quote:
What do you make of her assertion that abortion is the "..extermination of the powerless by the powerful"?
I think it's her personal opinion which she's entitled to. That said, U.S. law disagrees with her and so do I.
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Old September 24th, 2008, 03:58 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaaaman
You are absolutely correct.
Actually she's not correct at all.
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