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Old August 28th, 2011, 09:12 AM   #1
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Why should patriotic Americans support Israeli extremists? Makes no sense.



Should the American taxpayer be compelled to send billions in welfare payments to the state of Israel? Couldn't this money be spent here in the U.S., or better yet used to reduce our enormous deficit?



The Cost of Israel to the American People



quote: In the 1997 fiscal year, for example, Israel received $3 billion from the foreign aid budget, at least $525 million from other U.S. budgets, and $2 billion in federal loan guarantees. So the 1997 total of U.S. grants and loan guarantees to Israel was $5.5 billion. That’s $15,068,493 per day, 365 days a year.



Another article: Economist tallies swelling cost of Israel to US



I don’t understand why we have to pay Israel’s bills. What has Israel ever done for America?



1) Israel has not shown gratitude. For example, Israeli spies have seriously damaged American interests



Breaking the Taboo on Israel's Spying Efforts on the United States

Israel runs one of the most aggressive and damaging espionage networks targeting the U.S., yet public discussion about it is almost nil.



AIPAC Spying, Why Is The FBI Looking The Other Way?



quote: America learned, long ago with the infamous Jonathan Pollard case, that secrets going to Israel end up in the hands of America’s enemies. America’s most vital Cold War defense information, nuclear technology, air defense systems, classified weapons and even NATO defense plans in case of a Soviet invasion of Western Europe, all went to Russia as part of an arrangement between the Soviets and Israel.



2) Israel has re-exported advanced weapons to America's adversary China. What gratitude! America has suffered through embargoes for Israel and even fought wars for Israel and this is how we are repaid?



Selling US Weapons To China



quote: Israel has illegally re-exported advanced US defense technology to China. The problem was first recognized in 1992 when the State Department's inspector general reported that there was "overwhelming" evidence of a "systematic and growing pattern" of transfers. Israel has been the primary supplier of advanced defense technology to China since 1989.



3) Why is America subservient to Israel? Our politicians are bribed to betray their country. Real Americans should be outraged! America belongs to the people not the lobbyists.



National Capital Insiders Vote AIPAC, Israel's American Lobby, Second Most Powerful Interest Group in Washington



4) Israel's extremism endangers American troops according to General Petraeus.



quote from Petraeus: The [Israel-Palestine] conflict foments anti-American sentiment, due to a perception of U.S. favoritism for Israel. Arab anger over the Palestinian question limits the strength and depth of U.S. partnerships with governments and peoples in the AOR [Centcom's Area of Responsibility] and weakens the legitimacy of moderate regimes in the Arab world. Meanwhile, al-Qaeda and other militant groups exploit that anger to mobilize support.



Israel cares about its own selfish interests, not American troops.



5) I hate to see Americans made fools of by the Israelis.



Sharon to Peres: "We Control America"



America is a great country, we don’t have to be Israel’s puppet.
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Old August 28th, 2011, 09:27 AM   #2
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I agree.



In 2003 or 2004 Sharon promised Bush to halt settlements until a peace accord was reached. They continue to this day. Sharon was a liar, and neither Bush nor the MSM took Israel to task for this lie.



Calling Israel an ally is absurd, for as you noted: What has Israel ever done for the US? Israel bombed the hell out of the USS Pueblo with unmarked aircraft hoping to elicit a knee-jerk military response against Egypt.



Since the birth of Israel, her leaders mostly have been rabid Zionists, and one characteristic of a Zionist is to use any and all means, honesty be damned, to further Zionist ideals. Compromise with the Palestinians? No way. The present borders of Israel are an insult to Zionists who want Israel's borders extended to biblical Israel.



And the worst, the very worst aspect: The US should "protect" Israel because the Jews are "God's people." Yeah, they were, and still are according to the OT. But, they, according to the OT, are under a curse which remains in place until the coming of their Messiah. That hasn't happened, and the Christians who base support for Israel on the grounds of the Jews being God's people are duped.



The Zionists are Zionists first, a political not spiritual group. They are as cutthroat as any other self-serving secular governments.
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Old August 28th, 2011, 08:51 PM   #3
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Israeli brutality drags America's good name in the mud. Thanks Israel!



Check out these articles:



Could Israel Be Charged With War Crimes?

The repeated bombing of clearly marked civilian buildings is a flagrant violation of international law.



ISRAEL BOMBS GAZA UN SCHOOL, KILLS 43+



quote: At least 42 Palestinians sheltering in a UN school in the Jabaliya refugee camp near Gaza city were killed Tuesday afternoon after two Israeli tank shells exploded outside the school.
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Old August 29th, 2011, 12:10 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imaginethat View Post
Calling Israel an ally is absurd, for as you noted: What has Israel ever done for the US?
Israel has made sure that millions - Muslims and others - are angry at the U.S. When people think of the U.S. they think of Israeli brutality against civilians. Thanks Israel!



Quote:

the Christians who base support for Israel on the grounds of the Jews being God's people are duped.
Very true. Terrible to see the media bosses fooling the average American.



Israel expects Christians to serve Israel even though Israel discriminates against Christians!



Christians Discriminated Against by Israel
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Old August 29th, 2011, 06:29 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slippery Fish View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by imaginethat' timestamp='1314552473' post='350433

Calling Israel an ally is absurd, for as you noted: What has Israel ever done for the US?
Israel has made sure that millions - Muslims and others - are angry at the U.S. When people think of the U.S. they think of Israeli brutality against civilians. Thanks Israel!



Quote:

the Christians who base support for Israel on the grounds of the Jews being God's people are duped.
Very true. Terrible to see the media bosses fooling the average American.



Israel expects Christians to serve Israel even though Israel discriminates against Christians!



Christians Discriminated Against by Israel


America's "lap dog" stance continues:



Quote:
Abbas says UN recognition to be end of conflict with Israel



RAMALLAH, Aug. 27 (Xinhua) -- A United Nations' recognition of Palestine as an independent state would lead to an end of Israeli- Palestinian conflict, President Mahmoud Abbas said Saturday. "This will be the beginning to end the conflict and will establish a situation of which peace, justice and coexistence instead of oppression and aggression," Abbas said in the West Bank city of Ramallah.



Israel and the United States oppose the Palestinian bid to obtain recognition from the UN General Assembly next month and say that this recognition should be made through a negotiated agreement.



Last year, peace talks between Israel and the Palestinians stalemated after Israel resumed building settlements in the West Bank.



"Going to the UN doesn't mean to isolate Israel or confront the United States, but it is to achieve our dream in having an officially-recognized Palestinian state," Abbas added.



The Palestinians are ready to resume peace talks with Israel instead of going to the UN, Abbas said, but he put conditions that Israel stops settlement activities and recognizes the two-state solution.
http://news.xinhuane...c_131078885.htm



It's hard to engage in peace talks when one of the parties won't negotiate.



Israel has absolutely no intention of negotiating.
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Old August 29th, 2011, 07:00 AM   #6
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Will someone explain to me why some Christians support Israel?



1) Many Zionist leaders have been secular. For example Theodor Herzl was an atheist. Israel is one of the most secular nations in the world.



2) Many Israelis, both secular and religious, despise and ridicule Christianity. Christian missionaries face restrictions in Israel. Harassment is common.



3) Stalin was a big supporter of Israel for a time. He provided weapons for the Zionists when they ethnically cleansed the Palestinians back in 1948.



4) The Zionists cooperated with the Nazis.



THE ROLE OF ZIONISM IN THE HOLOCAUST



5) The Zionists committed numerous terrorist acts against the Palestinians.



List of Irgun attacks



6) The Zionists massacred whole villages of Palestinians, including children, and drove people from their homes. How would you feel if you were driven from your home?



7) There is nothing in the teachings of Jesus to oblige Christians to support Israel. In fact we should condemn Israel for their brutality. The belief that Israel is still favored by God after their rejection of the Messiah is un-Biblical and un-Christian.



Fortunately most Christians prefer the message of Jesus to the propaganda of the media bosses.
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Old July 16th, 2014, 12:37 PM   #7
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More barbarity from Israel:

Israel/Palestine: Unlawful Israeli Airstrikes Kill Civilians
Bombings of Civilian Structures Suggest Illegal Policy

Half of dead in Gaza airstrikes are women and children
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Old July 16th, 2014, 12:45 PM   #8
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Moslems don't need anything to go crazy however. The long war in the Philippines is just one example of where neither Israel nor America can be blamed for long standing violence by Moslems. Their history is one of massive violence, beginning with Mohammed.

This is not meant to impugn the OP.



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Old July 16th, 2014, 07:24 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imaginethat View Post
I agree.



In 2003 or 2004 Sharon promised Bush to halt settlements until a peace accord was reached. They continue to this day. Sharon was a liar, and neither Bush nor the MSM took Israel to task for this lie.



Calling Israel an ally is absurd, for as you noted: What has Israel ever done for the US? Israel bombed the hell out of the USS Pueblo with unmarked aircraft hoping to elicit a knee-jerk military response against Egypt.



Since the birth of Israel, her leaders mostly have been rabid Zionists, and one characteristic of a Zionist is to use any and all means, honesty be damned, to further Zionist ideals. Compromise with the Palestinians? No way. The present borders of Israel are an insult to Zionists who want Israel's borders extended to biblical Israel.



And the worst, the very worst aspect: The US should "protect" Israel because the Jews are "God's people." Yeah, they were, and still are according to the OT. But, they, according to the OT, are under a curse which remains in place until the coming of their Messiah. That hasn't happened, and the Christians who base support for Israel on the grounds of the Jews being God's people are duped.



The Zionists are Zionists first, a political not spiritual group. They are as cutthroat as any other self-serving secular governments.
I agree with you, IT...no foreign aid to anyone, period. Straight off, aid to those countries with their illegal children in the US should be debited for everything they run up at Hotel Sam.

Direct aid to Israel should also go...as with everyone else. Let the US simply pay for it's use of installations like it does in Oz.

Other than that...there's no stoppin' Israel from becoming Greater Israel. They will knock Iran on the head in a few months...and extend their borders to encompass the areas where rockets are being launched from. The Dome Of The Rock will be bulldozed soon, too.

It's all cool...and will make for great TV news viewing, too.

Slippery Gefiltefish will get bent outta shape over it...but, what the heck. I'm cool with that, too.

So...I'll lift my glass of SA cabernet right now and say "Lockheim, Israel!!!"
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Old July 21st, 2014, 09:46 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony View Post
I agree with you, IT...no foreign aid to anyone, period.
Cut off Israel. Good.
Quote:
Direct aid to Israel should also go...as with everyone else.
Cut off Israel. Good.
Quote:
Other than that...there's no stoppin' Israel from becoming Greater Israel. They will knock Iran on the head in a few months...and extend their borders to encompass the areas where rockets are being launched from. The Dome Of The Rock will be bulldozed soon, too.
We'll see.

Last edited by Slippery Fish; July 21st, 2014 at 09:49 AM.
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