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Old June 29th, 2018, 02:44 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by tristanrobin View Post
who the fuck are you?
The tolerant left at work.


Good job tris.
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Old June 29th, 2018, 02:46 PM   #22
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NO SIR !!!!! The REAL over riding question is, WHY DON'T WE PROSECUTE THE TRAITOROUS BASTARDS THAT HIRE THEM ????

ONLY when we make it it VERY EXPENSIVE, and start sending people to prison, for hiring them will we solve the problem.

There are NOT 11 million gardeners and nannies in the country. They work for COMPANIES, small, medium and LARGE !! When we start shutting down Tyson Foods and Walmarts, THEN we'll get the attention of the 1% who benefit from the illegal labor. When we start taking MONEY out of THEIR pockets, then we'll solve the problem.

Just earlier this year Asplundh got busted FOR THE SECOND TIME for having illegals on their pay role. They paid a $95 million dollar fine which seemed quite large to us, but to a $3.5 BILLION dollar per year company it was small change. They "promised" not to do it again.

What SHOULD have happened is they SHOULD HAVE LOST ALL OF THEIR GOVERNMENT CONTRACTS !!! Which is the majority of their business !!!

I would.love to prosecute the government!!!


How do you suggest we do that?

Would we take them to government courts? I think that may be a bit biased.
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Old June 29th, 2018, 02:48 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Clicker II View Post
I agree that employers should be policed and disciplined in cases where they hire illegals. The best way to stop this is by instituting E-Verify as a national standard for clearing illegals and requiring its use when hiring. If you can't require positive govt verified proof that someone is in the country legally it's really hard to prosecute employers. OBTW I have an opinion based on direct observation that many businesses out there are violating the law. Lets close it up. E-Verify is one fix for a many faceted problem with many solutions.
E-Verify is a good first step. But until we very aggressively prosecute those at the top of the food chain, we still won't solve the problem.

This is how they get away with it.

Walmart doesn't directly hire the cleaning crews for their stores. They hire a contractor to do the job. The main national contractor will then hire regional and local contractors who provide the people and materials needed to clean the stores. That way, when ICE finds illegals working at the local Walmart, the parent company has "plausible deniability". They can claim they had NO IDEA a subcontractor they never knew existed (hired by their main contractor) had illegals working for them. This was TRUMP'S defense when asked about illegal labor at his hotels.

They pay no fines. No one goes to prison. While admitting no wrong doing, they "promise" not to do it again. All the while pocketing millions of dollars in additional profit because every contractor that bids on that cleaning contract is almost forced into hiring illegal labor to compete.

In the Asplundh case, prosecutors had the prefect opportunity to MAKE AN EXAMPLE out of the company. They weren't using contract labor. They had illegals working directly for the company. They paid a $95 million dollar fine, but the $3.5 BILLION dollar per year company DID NOT LOSE A SINGLE ONE OF THEIR GOVERNMENT CONTRACTS !!!!! Which is the BULK of their work.

While the government's prosecutors and investigators were sitting in their drab government office, with gray walls and industrial grade carpet, sitting on cheap office chairs around a fake wood conference table, wearing $300 off the shelf suits, Timex watches and Payless brand shoes, patting themselves on the back for collecting that $95 million dollar fine, and toasting it with 10 year old scotch.

The company's lawyers were sitting in an oak paneled office, with carpet so deep you almost need to mow it, at an oak and marble conference table that cost more than you make in a year, wearing $3000 suits, Rolex watches and Gucci loafers, toasting the fact they ONLY PAID $95 million and DIDN'T LOSE A SINGLE contract, with 40 year old scotch.

Had I been the prosecutor, they'd of lost all of their federal contracts, as well as any state contracts paid for with federal dollars AND they've of been barred from bidding on new contracts for no less than FIVE years.

Even companies that don't hire illegals benefit from them being here. Even now, with the economy supposedly doing better than it has in years, the vast majority of Americans are NOT seeing any wage growth. Adjusted for inflation 0.2% this year over last. Now is that ALL the fault of the illegals ? No it's not. But their presence here, their willingness to work for low wages ripples all the way up into the upper middle class. It plays a role in keeping wages low for every one. So even if companies A, B and C don't hire illegals, they get the benefit because company D does !!

So E-verify is a good start, but it needs to be backed up with massive profit killing and potentially bankrupting penalties for hiring illegals or allowing subcontractors to do so. ONLY when we start taking money of the the pockets of the 1% will we solve the problem. As long as they are allowed to hide behind plausible deniability and pay pocket change fines, nothing will change.
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Old June 29th, 2018, 02:51 PM   #24
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I don't think so and I hope it's just a bad attempt at sarcasm. Or possibly British humor?
Now what does that have to do with E-Verify?
E-Verify explained

https://youtu.be/Kf7sY_JNQLI
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Old June 29th, 2018, 03:02 PM   #25
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Here's my question: What's the point in presenting facts, quotes, statistics, graphs, pie charts, photos, video and audio when you and your disciples immediately translate those facts into a "certain vernacular"
or (as I like to call it) .....

Trumpspeak? Alternative facts? Gaslighting? Exaggerations? Double speak?

You still think the whole separation of families at the border is/was manufactured and that the Russians didn't hack the 2016 election/campaign.

The Party of Conspiracy Theories jettisoned to power eating, sleeping and breathing every lunatic premise that popped up. Donald John Trump led the charge and you were happy to follow.


I am glad to know that i have disciples. Will you please help pass the word that they should use crypto if and when they choose to tithe.

Thanks.

It does not matter how many facts or graphs or shiny objects are used when the premise its self is dishonest.

Nobody is talking about immigrants besides leftists who are only doing so to muddy the waters. This is why they (you) wish to change the term (a tactic often employeed by leftists) from illegal immigrant to something snuggly like newly arrived undocumented immigrant worker person.
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Old June 29th, 2018, 03:16 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by BubbaJones View Post
E-Verify is a good first step. But until we very aggressively prosecute those at the top of the food chain, we still won't solve the problem.

This is how they get away with it.

Walmart doesn't directly hire the cleaning crews for their stores. They hire a contractor to do the job. The main national contractor will then hire regional and local contractors who provide the people and materials needed to clean the stores. That way, when ICE finds illegals working at the local Walmart, the parent company has "plausible deniability". They can claim they had NO IDEA a subcontractor they never knew existed (hired by their main contractor) had illegals working for them. This was TRUMP'S defense when asked about illegal labor at his hotels.

They pay no fines. No one goes to prison. While admitting no wrong doing, they "promise" not to do it again. All the while pocketing millions of dollars in additional profit because every contractor that bids on that cleaning contract is almost forced into hiring illegal labor to compete.

In the Asplundh case, prosecutors had the prefect opportunity to MAKE AN EXAMPLE out of the company. They weren't using contract labor. They had illegals working directly for the company. They paid a $95 million dollar fine, but the $3.5 BILLION dollar per year company DID NOT LOSE A SINGLE ONE OF THEIR GOVERNMENT CONTRACTS !!!!! Which is the BULK of their work.

While the government's prosecutors and investigators were sitting in their drab government office, with gray walls and industrial grade carpet, sitting on cheap office chairs around a fake wood conference table, wearing $300 off the shelf suits, Timex watches and Payless brand shoes, patting themselves on the back for collecting that $95 million dollar fine, and toasting it with 10 year old scotch.

The company's lawyers were sitting in an oak paneled office, with carpet so deep you almost need to mow it, at an oak and marble conference table that cost more than you make in a year, wearing $3000 suits, Rolex watches and Gucci loafers, toasting the fact they ONLY PAID $95 million and DIDN'T LOSE A SINGLE contract, with 40 year old scotch.

Had I been the prosecutor, they'd of lost all of their federal contracts, as well as any state contracts paid for with federal dollars AND they've of been barred from bidding on new contracts for no less than FIVE years.

Even companies that don't hire illegals benefit from them being here. Even now, with the economy supposedly doing better than it has in years, the vast majority of Americans are NOT seeing any wage growth. Adjusted for inflation 0.2% this year over last. Now is that ALL the fault of the illegals ? No it's not. But their presence here, their willingness to work for low wages ripples all the way up into the upper middle class. It plays a role in keeping wages low for every one. So even if companies A, B and C don't hire illegals, they get the benefit because company D does !!

So E-verify is a good start, but it needs to be backed up with massive profit killing and potentially bankrupting penalties for hiring illegals or allowing subcontractors to do so. ONLY when we start taking money of the the pockets of the 1% will we solve the problem. As long as they are allowed to hide behind plausible deniability and pay pocket change fines, nothing will change.
NOLO press is a good source for what is and isn't legal. It appears that hiring a contractor will in some cases relieve you of responsibility for their employees immigration status. That's a loophole to be closed. But I will warn that simply thrashing the 1% you refer to will do a lot more harm to the working people that it'll do the the 1%.
https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclope...mmigrants.html
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Old June 29th, 2018, 03:35 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Clicker II View Post
NOLO press is a good source for what is and isn't legal. It appears that hiring a contractor will in some cases relieve you of responsibility for their employees immigration status. That's a loophole to be closed. But I will warn that simply thrashing the 1% you refer to will do a lot more harm to the working people that it'll do the the 1%.
https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclope...mmigrants.html
When they passed the Patriot Act, the single biggest destruction of our constitutionally guaranteed rights ever passed .........

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

When they invented "enemy combatant" right out of thin air, meaning not subject to either the Geneva conventions nor US law ....... (in other words we can torture your ass)

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

When they opened Guantanamo Bay prison (as well as 14 other not so secret CIA prison camps) started snatching people right off the streets of their home towns and villages, aka rendition .......

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

When they started the warrantless wire tap program, promising it would NEVER be used to SPY on US citizens ...............

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

I'm not talking about random thrashing of the 1% over the illegal issue. All we need to do is make a few examples of those that ARE hiring them.

So, if you're not hiring illegals, you have nothing to fear !!!!
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Old June 29th, 2018, 04:27 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by BubbaJones View Post
When they passed the Patriot Act, the single biggest destruction of our constitutionally guaranteed rights ever passed .........

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

When they invented "enemy combatant" right out of thin air, meaning not subject to either the Geneva conventions nor US law ....... (in other words we can torture your ass)

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

When they opened Guantanamo Bay prison (as well as 14 other not so secret CIA prison camps) started snatching people right off the streets of their home towns and villages, aka rendition .......

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

When they started the warrantless wire tap program, promising it would NEVER be used to SPY on US citizens ...............

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

I'm not talking about random thrashing of the 1% over the illegal issue. All we need to do is make a few examples of those that ARE hiring them.

So, if you're not hiring illegals, you have nothing to fear !!!!

I agree w/ everything that you say becides the disingenuous way that you are attempting to present it as a partisan issue.


Quote:
Senate and House Vote Roll Call on U.S. Patriot Act 2001 & 2006

These are the 98 U.S. senators for voted in favor of the US Patriot Act of 2001 (Senator Landrieu (D-LA) did not vote) Senator Russ Feingold of Wisconsin was the only senator who voted against the Patriot Act on October 24, of 2001.



These are the 10 US senators who voted against the Patriot Act Reauthorizing Act of March 2006. The senators in bold type voted in favor of the Patriot Act in 2001.

NAYs ---10
Akaka (D-HI)
Bingaman (D-NM)
Byrd (D-WV)
Feingold (D-WI)
Harkin (D-IA)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Murray (D-WA)
Wyden (D-OR)

Inouye (D-HI) did not vote on the 2006 Patriot Act Renewal


Read more here


https://educate-yourself.org/cn/patr...natevote.shtml
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Old June 29th, 2018, 04:33 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by BubbaJones View Post
When they passed the Patriot Act, the single biggest destruction of our constitutionally guaranteed rights ever passed .........

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

When they invented "enemy combatant" right out of thin air, meaning not subject to either the Geneva conventions nor US law ....... (in other words we can torture your ass)

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

When they opened Guantanamo Bay prison (as well as 14 other not so secret CIA prison camps) started snatching people right off the streets of their home towns and villages, aka rendition .......

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

When they started the warrantless wire tap program, promising it would NEVER be used to SPY on US citizens ...............

The fright wing said, "if you're not a terrorist, you have nothing to fear."

I'm not talking about random thrashing of the 1% over the illegal issue. All we need to do is make a few examples of those that ARE hiring them.

So, if you're not hiring illegals, you have nothing to fear !!!!
Little of what you claim is only more than a few iotas rational. I could argue the points with you but I've learned that going thru that process with an idealogue is a waste of both our time.
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Old June 29th, 2018, 04:41 PM   #30
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I agree w/ everything that you say becides the disingenuous way that you are attempting to present it as a partisan issue.





Read more here


https://educate-yourself.org/cn/patr...natevote.shtml
From what your link says, it's most definitely partisan issue. I'm not sure how you could miss that.
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