Political Forums  

Go Back   Defending The Truth Political Forum > Philosophy and Religion > Religion > Atheism


Thanks Tree15Thanks
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old December 24th, 2012, 11:59 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
Nwolfe35's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Posts: 14,966


If a stranger approached you on the street and told you his name as Tom you would probably believe him. After all, why not? Tom is a fairly common name...I'm sure you know a Tom or two as part of your family or circle of friends. If not, you are aware of other people named Tom...Tom Hanks, Tom Arnold, Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Edison or Tommy Lee Jones....


*


If this same stranger told you that his name was Korwac the Sixteenth...now you may have reason to doubt it. You might require a driver's license or a birth certificate before believing this claim.


*


If this same stranger told* you that his name was Korwac the Sixteenth and he as the Emperor of the Verlaxian Star Empire and he came from the planet Verlax VII...I have no doubt that you would not believe him. Not that you have any evidence that his claim is not true...but simply due to the fact that his claim has no evidence whatsoever...and it's a FANTASTIC claim. Even if he presented a book detailing the Verlaxian Empire and going on about how Korwac the Sixteenth was the current Emperor...you still would probably not believe him. Even if that book had some details correct...like the positions of the planets in our solar system...or the relative positions of known starts within our galaxy...you would still probably not believe him.


*


To me religion (ALL religions) are the equivilant of a stranger telling me he is Korwac and that he is the Emperor of the Verlaxian Empire. There is simply no evidence that any of this is true....even if the book you use to try and "prove" your claim gets some details right, it's not evidence that the fantastic claims in the book are factual. Even if this guy wholeheartedly believes his own story...that is not evidence that his story is true. Even if he has hundreds (or thousands or millions) of people who believe hiim...this is still not evidence that his story is true.


*


It takes no "faith" to disbelieve his story...I don't need "evidence" that his story is untrue to come to the logical conclusion that his story is untrue...even to come to the conclusion that the odds of his story being true are so remote that I should probably base my life on the idea that his story is NOT true. unless some kind of evidence comes along later to change my mind. Note I have not said that his story is untrue...only that the logical conclusion is to base my life as if his story were not true unless I get other evidence.


*


I'm not going to live my life in fear that the Verlaxians are going to destroy this planet unless we start paying tribute to Korwac...I'm not going to obey Korwacs edicts simply because he threatens this planet with destruction from his vast fleet of starships....


*


This is why I am an atheist....not because there is overwhelming evidence that "proves" there is no god....but because there is UNDERWHELMING evidence that proves that there is.
Nwolfe35 is offline  
Old December 24th, 2012, 12:24 PM   #2
Your Own Moderator
 
pensacola_niceman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Pensacola, FL
Posts: 31,694


Isn't the big beautiful blue sky, the fall colors of autumn, a stunning sunset on an isolated beach, and the face of an innocent child proof enough of God's*existence?
Thanks from Slippery Fish, webguy4 and Blade
pensacola_niceman is offline  
Old December 24th, 2012, 12:44 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Nwolfe35's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Posts: 14,966
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="pensacola_niceman" data-cid="448051" data-time="1356380661">Isn't the big beautiful blue sky, the fall colors of autumn, a stunning sunset on an isolated beach, and the face of an innocent child proof enough of God's*existence? </blockquote>


No more proof of god's existence than they are proof that these things were done by Korwac the Sixteenth.
Nwolfe35 is offline  
Old December 24th, 2012, 12:58 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: lebanon
Posts: 1,437
isnt all grounds being essentially dirt and the high natural color of nothing, a surprisin superpower of a lousy contradictive negative mind, and the back of worse crimes being any one random jaleousy, is enough prove of gods existence???

in any way of logical terms such could exist, but if some past dimensions to this one arent takin advantage of present existence of futur rights turning it constantly to worse inferiority to stay the first poetential of right existing superiority in futur, that would make the most vicious animals gerb
Thanks from Blade
absols is offline  
Old December 24th, 2012, 01:12 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Bookworm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,718
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Nwolfe35" data-cid="448050" data-time="1356379160">


If this same stranger told* you that his name was Korwac the Sixteenth and he as the Emperor of the Verlaxian Star Empire and he came from the planet Verlax VII...I have no doubt that you would not believe him. Not that you have any evidence that his claim is not true...but simply due to the fact that his claim has no evidence whatsoever...and it's a FANTASTIC claim.</blockquote>


But what if this stranger spent three years with you and during that time he healed sickness with just a touch of his hand or a spoken word. What if he even raised someone from the dead? Would you at least suspect that he might not simply be an ordinary person like everyone else?
Thanks from webguy4
Bookworm is offline  
Old December 24th, 2012, 01:47 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Nwolfe35's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Posts: 14,966
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Bookworm" data-cid="448061" data-time="1356383546"><blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Nwolfe35" data-cid="448050" data-time="1356379160">


If this same stranger told* you that his name was Korwac the Sixteenth and he as the Emperor of the Verlaxian Star Empire and he came from the planet Verlax VII...I have no doubt that you would not believe him. Not that you have any evidence that his claim is not true...but simply due to the fact that his claim has no evidence whatsoever...and it's a FANTASTIC claim.
</blockquote>


But what if this stranger spent three years with you and during that time he healed sickness with just a touch of his hand or a spoken word. What if he even raised someone from the dead? Would you at least suspect that he might not simply be an ordinary person like everyone else?</blockquote>


I absolutely would.


*


But in this case it would be as if he handed me a book that said he did those things...with no first hand reporting whatsoever.


*


It's like Lewis Black said in one of his comedy shows...(I'm quoting this from memory so it may not be exact)..."But Lewis, my Christian friends say, when you die angels come down and gently carry you back to heaven. To which I say, unless you have photographs the court says that is hearsay."
Nwolfe35 is offline  
Old December 24th, 2012, 02:07 PM   #7
Your Own Moderator
 
pensacola_niceman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Pensacola, FL
Posts: 31,694
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Bookworm" data-cid="448061" data-time="1356383546"><blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Nwolfe35" data-cid="448050" data-time="1356379160">


If this same stranger told* you that his name was Korwac the Sixteenth and he as the Emperor of the Verlaxian Star Empire and he came from the planet Verlax VII...I have no doubt that you would not believe him. Not that you have any evidence that his claim is not true...but simply due to the fact that his claim has no evidence whatsoever...and it's a FANTASTIC claim.
</blockquote>


But what if this stranger spent three years with you and during that time he healed sickness with just a touch of his hand or a spoken word. What if he even raised someone from the dead? Would you at least suspect that he might not simply be an ordinary person like everyone else?</blockquote>


Why doesn't Jesus do that shit anymore?
Thanks from Blade
pensacola_niceman is offline  
Old December 24th, 2012, 02:13 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
imaginethat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Western Slope, Colorado
Posts: 56,694


You cleared it up for me yesterday.


*


Atheism is a faith-less religion, or if you prefer, creed. Yes indeed a faith-less creed is an oxymoron.


*


But that's just it. An atheistic worldview is oxymoronic. It is maintainable only when, and this is the atheistic fairy tale, "someday" we'll understand the origin of it all, or maybe we'll never understand the origin of it all, but in either case the origin of it all really isn't important, certainly doesn't imply a creator or creators, and regardless, the origin of it all doesn't have any appreciable influence on what's happening now.


*


And that IS an atheist's faith. Whether the ultimate origin of it all is important, and whether a creator or creators are involved is a matter of faith. Theists' faith is that yes, the ultimate origin is important, yes, a creator or creators are involved.


*


The atheists' faith is just the opposite, and an inconvenient truth for you and other atheists like you Nwolfe, is that you make your stand on the shifting sands of scientific knowledge.
imaginethat is offline  
Old December 24th, 2012, 02:16 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
Nwolfe35's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
Posts: 14,966
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="imaginethat" data-cid="448069" data-time="1356387228">You cleared it up for me yesterday.


*


Atheism is a faith-less religion, or if you prefer, creed. Yes indeed a faith-less creed is an oxymoron.


*


But that's just it. An atheistic worldview is oxymoronic. It is maintainable only when, and this is the atheistic fairy tale, "someday" we'll understand the origin of it all, or maybe we'll never understand the origin of it all, but in either case the origin of it all really isn't important, certainly doesn't imply a creator or creators, and regardless, the origin of it all doesn't have any appreciable influence on what's happening now.


*


And that IS an atheist's faith. Whether the ultimate origin of it all is important, and whether a creator or creators are involved is a matter of faith. Theists' faith is that yes, the ultimate origin is important, yes, a creator or creators are involved.


*


The atheists' faith is just the opposite, and an inconvenient truth for you and other atheists like you Nwolfe, is that you make your stand on the shifting sands of scientific knowledge.</blockquote>


Not at all....


*


As per my example...we may never know what Korwac's real name is....or where he*is really from. But that doesn't stop us from making the logical conclusion that he isn't the Emperor of the Verlaxian Empire
Nwolfe35 is offline  
Old December 24th, 2012, 02:17 PM   #10
I'm debt free
 
TNVolunteer73's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Lebanon, TN
Posts: 34,209
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Nwolfe35" data-cid="448050" data-time="1356379160">If a stranger approached you on the street and told you his name as Tom you would probably believe him. After all, why not? Tom is a fairly common name...I'm sure you know a Tom or two as part of your family or circle of friends. If not, you are aware of other people named Tom...Tom Hanks, Tom Arnold, Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Edison or Tommy Lee Jones....


*


If this same stranger told you that his name was Korwac the Sixteenth...now you may have reason to doubt it. You might require a driver's license or a birth certificate before believing this claim.


*


If this same stranger told* you that his name was Korwac the Sixteenth and he as the Emperor of the Verlaxian Star Empire and he came from the planet Verlax VII...I have no doubt that you would not believe him. Not that you have any evidence that his claim is not true...but simply due to the fact that his claim has no evidence whatsoever...and it's a FANTASTIC claim. Even if he presented a book detailing the Verlaxian Empire and going on about how Korwac the Sixteenth was the current Emperor...you still would probably not believe him. Even if that book had some details correct...like the positions of the planets in our solar system...or the relative positions of known starts within our galaxy...you would still probably not believe him.


*


To me religion (ALL religions) are the equivilant of a stranger telling me he is Korwac and that he is the Emperor of the Verlaxian Empire. There is simply no evidence that any of this is true....even if the book you use to try and "prove" your claim gets some details right, it's not evidence that the fantastic claims in the book are factual. Even if this guy wholeheartedly believes his own story...that is not evidence that his story is true. Even if he has hundreds (or thousands or millions) of people who believe hiim...this is still not evidence that his story is true.


*


It takes no "faith" to disbelieve his story...I don't need "evidence" that his story is untrue to come to the logical conclusion that his story is untrue...even to come to the conclusion that the odds of his story being true are so remote that I should probably base my life on the idea that his story is NOT true. unless some kind of evidence comes along later to change my mind. Note I have not said that his story is untrue...only that the logical conclusion is to base my life as if his story were not true unless I get other evidence.


*


I'm not going to live my life in fear that the Verlaxians are going to destroy this planet unless we start paying tribute to Korwac...I'm not going to obey Korwacs edicts simply because he threatens this planet with destruction from his vast fleet of starships....


*


This is why I am an atheist....not because there is overwhelming evidence that "proves" there is no god....but because there is UNDERWHELMING evidence that proves that there is.</blockquote>


*
<blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="Nwolfe35" data-cid="448050" data-time="1356379160">If a stranger approached you on the street and told you his name as Tom you would probably believe him. After all, why not? Tom is a fairly common name...I'm sure you know a Tom or two as part of your family or circle of friends. If not, you are aware of other people named Tom...Tom Hanks, Tom Arnold, Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Edison or Tommy Lee Jones....


*


If this same stranger told you that his name was Korwac the Sixteenth...now you may have reason to doubt it. You might require a driver's license or a birth certificate before believing this claim.


*


If this same stranger told* you that his name was Korwac the Sixteenth and he as the Emperor of the Verlaxian Star Empire and he came from the planet Verlax VII...I have no doubt that you would not believe him. Not that you have any evidence that his claim is not true...but simply due to the fact that his claim has no evidence whatsoever...and it's a FANTASTIC claim. Even if he presented a book detailing the Verlaxian Empire and going on about how Korwac the Sixteenth was the current Emperor...you still would probably not believe him. Even if that book had some details correct...like the positions of the planets in our solar system...or the relative positions of known starts within our galaxy...you would still probably not believe him.


*


To me religion (ALL religions) are the equivilant of a stranger telling me he is Korwac and that he is the Emperor of the Verlaxian Empire. There is simply no evidence that any of this is true....even if the book you use to try and "prove" your claim gets some details right, it's not evidence that the fantastic claims in the book are factual. Even if this guy wholeheartedly believes his own story...that is not evidence that his story is true. Even if he has hundreds (or thousands or millions) of people who believe hiim...this is still not evidence that his story is true.


*


It takes no "faith" to disbelieve his story...I don't need "evidence" that his story is untrue to come to the logical conclusion that his story is untrue...even to come to the conclusion that the odds of his story being true are so remote that I should probably base my life on the idea that his story is NOT true. unless some kind of evidence comes along later to change my mind. Note I have not said that his story is untrue...only that the logical conclusion is to base my life as if his story were not true unless I get other evidence.


*


I'm not going to live my life in fear that the Verlaxians are going to destroy this planet unless we start paying tribute to Korwac...I'm not going to obey Korwacs edicts simply because he threatens this planet with destruction from his vast fleet of starships....


*


This is why I am an atheist....not because there is overwhelming evidence that "proves" there is no god....but because there is UNDERWHELMING evidence that proves that there is.</blockquote>


Thats fine I find evidence everywhere there is a God.*
TNVolunteer73 is offline  
Reply

  Defending The Truth Political Forum > Philosophy and Religion > Religion > Atheism

Tags
atheist



Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Atheist in the woods Zack Atheism 10 January 18th, 2011 01:58 PM
God is an Atheist tadpole256 Atheism 13 August 9th, 2010 02:35 PM
Atheist Apocalypse 2 davidmabus2006 Atheism 1 August 23rd, 2009 08:06 PM
Atheist Watch :: Atheist Billboard Removed tadpole256 Atheism 3 February 22nd, 2009 05:53 PM
Thank God I'm an Atheist tadpole256 Atheism 10 December 21st, 2008 04:23 PM


Facebook Twitter RSS Feed



Copyright © 2005-2013 Defending The Truth. All rights reserved.