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Old May 28th, 2017, 04:01 AM   #31
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The precursors of your example sound true , but objectively, why have trouble sleeping? Yeah, I have an honesty compulsion as well, but what is its practical value ?
It's a behavior that evolved, it's highly developed in primates, but it's also found in other mammals.
It's part of being a social animal, there are people where the facility is not as strong as in other people (we call these people psychopaths).
It's one of the behaviors that allowed human civilization to emerge.
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Old May 28th, 2017, 04:54 AM   #32
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Oh, I do. Your absolute fear of women. Your total sense that if your fictitious god of the bible wasn't watching you and would instantly condemn you to an eternity of abject suffering if you did, you would rape and steal and kill. Your inability to see that there are people who are good people because they are simply good people.

Fascinating stuff.
Your analysis of me is off the mark on all counts. I do have a fear of women, but not absolute.

Total sense of God? No, I am a mortal man subject to human doubt.

Instantly condemned to eternity of abject suffering? No, Jesus has taken that away. Tempted to rape and steal and kill? No, I don't believe I would rape and kill, I have stolen and I regret it deeply and will not do it again. No, I see many people who are good, most better than me.

I did not start this to be a discussion about me, this is all response. I haven't brought up God or Christianity here.

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Old May 28th, 2017, 02:25 PM   #33
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It's a behavior that evolved, it's highly developed in primates, but it's also found in other mammals.
It's part of being a social animal, there are people where the facility is not as strong as in other people (we call these people psychopaths).
It's one of the behaviors that allowed human civilization to emerge.
So you consider that a compulsion for honesty has survival benefits for the human species?
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Old May 28th, 2017, 02:56 PM   #34
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So you consider that a compulsion for honesty has survival benefits for the human species?
Let's say for fairness, yes. It's in animals too.
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Old May 28th, 2017, 03:10 PM   #35
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Let's say for fairness, yes. It's in animals too.
A movie a couple of years ago, made from an atheist point of view, The Invention of Lying.

Perhaps should have been made from the opposite point of view. Lying apparently would have survival benefits for the individual, while honesty benefits the species.
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Old May 28th, 2017, 03:36 PM   #36
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The evolved trait is empathy. I don't like it when someone lies to me or hurts me and I understand that others feel the same way so I will behave in ways that don't hurt others.
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Old May 28th, 2017, 03:37 PM   #37
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A movie a couple of years ago, made from an atheist point of view, The Invention of Lying.

Perhaps should have been made from the opposite point of view. Lying apparently would have survival benefits for the individual, while honesty benefits the species.
The other thing you consistently avoid in these philosophical threads of yours is that both in animals and in humans, there is a significant variance. As a valid generalization, people are honest. And no sky-daddy required.
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Old May 28th, 2017, 03:40 PM   #38
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A movie a couple of years ago, made from an atheist point of view, The Invention of Lying.

Perhaps should have been made from the opposite point of view. Lying apparently would have survival benefits for the individual, while honesty benefits the species.
You missed the point of the movie then.

The point of the movie was to show how and why the lie about God took hold and why people swallowed the lie.

People will believe a comforting lie over an uncomfortable truth most of the time.
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Old May 28th, 2017, 03:55 PM   #39
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The other thing you consistently avoid in these philosophical threads of yours is that both in animals and in humans, there is a significant variance. As a valid generalization, people are honest. And no sky-daddy required.
My experience , honesty in people falls into three categories.

1. Always honest

2. Will lie or cheat anytime it profits them and they can get away with it.

3. Some go with the flow, whatever people around them are doing.
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Old May 28th, 2017, 03:56 PM   #40
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My experience , honesty in people falls into three categories.

1. Always honest

2. Will lie or cheat anytime it profits them and they can get away with it.

3. Some go with the flow, whatever people around them are doing.
True, but what does it have to do with the premise of this thread?
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