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Old December 20th, 2016, 08:43 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by imaginethat View Post
This "hell bent on going to war with Russia" is a line straight out of the Kremlin. It is what the paranoid Russkis believe. Wait, no, because Putin and his cronies lined their pockets when the price of oil was high, this is what the Russian citizens have been told..

Russian infrastructure makes ours look really good. Take away oil exports, and there's nothing to the Russian "industrial base." Russians were marching in the streets in 2012, demanding an end to the corruption endemic in the government and the highest echelons of business.

Putin came down hard, and has murdered journalists and opposition leaders ever since. But discontent simmers, inside the opposition to Putin's United Russia party and from the nostalgics who murmur about how things were better under Stalin,

So, to distract the people they've been told the US is looking for a nuclear war with Russia. Collectively, the horror of WWII still lurks in the minds of many. "The US wants a nuclear war with us' scares the hell out of the people. Of course, the Good Tsar Putin will save them.

Now all that makes sense from a Russian's point of view, but what gets me is Americans picking up the Russian line and repeating it like a mantra.

It's bullshit. Russia is our enemy according to them. They're not to be trusted or believed. It's their choice. It's true, over the last 60 years or so Western leaders have misled Russian leaders. Gorbachev in particular was screwed by GHW. But nobody in the US government wants a nuclear war with Russia.

No body.
Ruskies should never be trusted and assume they are up to dirty deeds.
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Old December 20th, 2016, 09:18 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by imaginethat View Post
If it weren't for the fact that hammering Obama is more important to you than determining whether a foreign power attempted to influence our election, we might have a united front with which to face Putin.

But you, brain damaged you, somehow rate ridiculing Obama ahead of standing shoulder to shoulder with your fellow Americans facing down a possible - and likely, certainly within character - foreign threat.
If it weren't for the fact that this has been going on for longer than most people think, you might have an argument. But the FACT is, this government has allowed it for far too long. Everyone is behind a president who does what he says he will do. Obimbo is NOT that president, and the Russians, Chinese, and others know that. I ridicule Obimbo because he is a feckless, useless occupant of the White House. And I will be ridiculing that clown long after he's gone. The damage he's done to this country warrants ridicule.
No one has yet given a viable argument as to how the Russians affected the outcome of this election. All I'm seeing is the Democrats using the Russians as a means of delegitimizing Trump's presidency.
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Old December 20th, 2016, 09:53 AM   #93
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If it weren't for the fact that this has been going on for longer than most people think, you might have an argument. But the FACT is, this government has allowed it for far too long. Everyone is behind a president who does what he says he will do. Obimbo is NOT that president, and the Russians, Chinese, and others know that. I ridicule Obimbo because he is a feckless, useless occupant of the White House. And I will be ridiculing that clown long after he's gone. The damage he's done to this country warrants ridicule.
No one has yet given a viable argument as to how the Russians affected the outcome of this election. All I'm seeing is the Democrats using the Russians as a means of delegitimizing Trump's presidency.


I think many of us are curious to know WHAT you think Obama should DO about the Russians' hacking. You are correct. Russia has been hacking for quite some time. What you may not know is that not only did Obama know about it, so did senior members of Congress. What did THEY do about it? Senior Members of Congress had been briefed in September on the pervasive Russian threat to the core functioning of our democracy. Obama dispatched FBI director James Comey, DHS Secretary Jeh Johnston, and White House counterterrorism and homeland security advisor Lisa Monaco to brief the so-called “Gang of 12” lawmakers: House & Senate leaders, as well as the chairmen and ranking members on the Homeland Security and Intelligence Committee.
They knew. And yet it appears little was done to stop Vladimir Putin’s efforts to put Donald Trump in the White House.
This has the most galling aspect of this whole affair: not that Russia deployed a successful covert influence campaign against America, but that our lawmakers on both sides of the political aisle failed to take more aggressive efforts to halt this threat to our democracy.
Now you can blame Obama. I can blame Obama and Congress, but the fact that Russia 'interfered' with our political process SHOULD concern everyone, whether you support Hillary or Donald. Oddly, many Americans find this entertaining.
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Old December 20th, 2016, 11:46 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by Clara007 View Post
I think many of us are curious to know WHAT you think Obama should DO about the Russians' hacking. You are correct. Russia has been hacking for quite some time. What you may not know is that not only did Obama know about it, so did senior members of Congress. What did THEY do about it? Senior Members of Congress had been briefed in September on the pervasive Russian threat to the core functioning of our democracy. Obama dispatched FBI director James Comey, DHS Secretary Jeh Johnston, and White House counterterrorism and homeland security advisor Lisa Monaco to brief the so-called “Gang of 12” lawmakers: House & Senate leaders, as well as the chairmen and ranking members on the Homeland Security and Intelligence Committee.
They knew. And yet it appears little was done to stop Vladimir Putin’s efforts to put Donald Trump in the White House.
This has the most galling aspect of this whole affair: not that Russia deployed a successful covert influence campaign against America, but that our lawmakers on both sides of the political aisle failed to take more aggressive efforts to halt this threat to our democracy.
Now you can blame Obama. I can blame Obama and Congress, but the fact that Russia 'interfered' with our political process SHOULD concern everyone, whether you support Hillary or Donald. Oddly, many Americans find this entertaining.
I think the US has cyberwarfare capabilities. For the sake of discussion, lets assume we do, but the Administration has decided to keep mum about it, what we have, when we've used it.

Nobody reading this forum can't argue with what I'm about to say. If Obama came out and "spilled the beans" so to speak, the same voices, like caco's, would be criticizing Obimbo for revealing our capabilities.


You could bet your life savings on that.
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Old December 20th, 2016, 02:16 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by Clara007 View Post
I think many of us are curious to know WHAT you think Obama should DO about the Russians' hacking. You are correct. Russia has been hacking for quite some time. What you may not know is that not only did Obama know about it, so did senior members of Congress. What did THEY do about it? Senior Members of Congress had been briefed in September on the pervasive Russian threat to the core functioning of our democracy. Obama dispatched FBI director James Comey, DHS Secretary Jeh Johnston, and White House counterterrorism and homeland security advisor Lisa Monaco to brief the so-called “Gang of 12” lawmakers: House & Senate leaders, as well as the chairmen and ranking members on the Homeland Security and Intelligence Committee.
They knew. And yet it appears little was done to stop Vladimir Putin’s efforts to put Donald Trump in the White House.
This has the most galling aspect of this whole affair: not that Russia deployed a successful covert influence campaign against America, but that our lawmakers on both sides of the political aisle failed to take more aggressive efforts to halt this threat to our democracy.
Now you can blame Obama. I can blame Obama and Congress, but the fact that Russia 'interfered' with our political process SHOULD concern everyone, whether you support Hillary or Donald. Oddly, many Americans find this entertaining.
OK, lets us call it like it is. The ENTIRE Federal government did not recognize hacking as a priority until our own meddling in the affairs of others came back to bite us. And then it was OMG they're trying to manipulate our elections. They can't do that, only we can. And then we have Obimbo telling us that he personally told Putin to knock it off or else. The "else", according to insider Democrats, never came. The Russians, Chinese, and others continue to do it to this day. That manufactured outrage did not materialize until the Democrats needed a scape-goat for losing the election.
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Old December 20th, 2016, 02:33 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by imaginethat View Post
I think the US has cyberwarfare capabilities. For the sake of discussion, lets assume we do, but the Administration has decided to keep mum about it, what we have, when we've used it.

Nobody reading this forum can't argue with what I'm about to say. If Obama came out and "spilled the beans" so to speak, the same voices, like caco's, would be criticizing Obimbo for revealing our capabilities.


You could bet your life savings on that.
Again you'd be wrong. There is no question we are doing the same. Ask Germany about that. What I'm talking about is the feigned outrage from a government that thinks we're too stupid to see through their crap. Hillary lost because a majority of states did not trust her and wanted nothing more to do with the Obimbo platform. It's that simple. The supposed Russian involvement is nothing more than a tool to delegitimize the Trump presidency.
If Trump defaults on his promises I'll be more than happy to slam his ass. My only concern is for the health of this country. I'm almost as repulsed by the Republican Party as I am of the Democrats. Neither are making our wishes their priority. It's all about assuming as much power over us and the states as required for total domination. And they're well on their way to achieving that goal.
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Old December 20th, 2016, 02:40 PM   #97
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No one has yet given a viable argument as to how the Russians affected the outcome of this election.
What he said!!!
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Old December 20th, 2016, 06:43 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by caconservative View Post
Again you'd be wrong. There is no question we are doing the same. Ask Germany about that. What I'm talking about is the feigned outrage from a government that thinks we're too stupid to see through their crap. Hillary lost because a majority of states did not trust her and wanted nothing more to do with the Obimbo platform. It's that simple. The supposed Russian involvement is nothing more than a tool to delegitimize the Trump presidency.
If Trump defaults on his promises I'll be more than happy to slam his ass. My only concern is for the health of this country. I'm almost as repulsed by the Republican Party as I am of the Democrats. Neither are making our wishes their priority. It's all about assuming as much power over us and the states as required for total domination. And they're well on their way to achieving that goal.
You didn't address my point.
Nobody reading this forum can't argue with what I'm about to say. If Obama came out and "spilled the beans" so to speak, the same voices, like caco's, would be criticizing Obimbo for revealing our capabilities.

Take a swing at it.
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Old December 20th, 2016, 06:54 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by Clara007 View Post
I think many of us are curious to know WHAT you think Obama should DO about the Russians' hacking.....
That is like having the fox guard the hen house. The most important thing is to protect the government servers and government communications. So the worst thing is to allow the Secretary of State to make government communications on a private home server. What kind administration is he running when he is one of the people communicating on that private server.

In other words, create and maintain proper electronic defensive systems and require all to adhere to it.

Obama most certainly did not do that.
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Old December 20th, 2016, 07:01 PM   #100
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My honest and legitimate question is: If they have all this undeniable and supported evidence, why not release it en masse to the public? Why not expose it and show the American people that Russia did, in fact, manipulate the election?

Until they provide actual sound evidence, it is hearsay, speculation, political grandstanding, saber-rattling, and impotent rage on a massive scale.
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