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Old September 11th, 2012, 08:32 AM   #1
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I read this article today and could only shake my head in disbelief. If anyone in this great nation wonders why we have an immigration problem, look no further than this article in todays LA Times. Of course it would have to be my state leading the charge on lunacy:





L.A. to consider multi-use library cards for illegal immigrants



The cards, under study now, would provide a form of identification for those without driver's licenses and could be used to open bank accounts, transfer funds and access cash.



Los Angeles officials are considering a plan to turn the library card into a form of identification that the city's large illegal immigrant population could use to open bank accounts and access an array of city services.





Yes folks, instead of tracking them down and deporting them, LA and the Bay area want to give them a way to open bank accounts, transfer funds and fly on airplanes.



But it gets better:





[font=Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif]L.A.'s proposed card would not go as far as programs in other cities.[/font]





[font=Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif]San Francisco's City ID card, for example, is accepted as a form of identification by most city banks, airlines and local businesses. The San Francisco card also lists a user's medical conditions and an emergency contact, said Karen Hong Yee, director of the San Francisco County clerk's office.[/font]





[font=Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif]Oakland is contracting with SF Global, an L.A.-based company that operates prepaid banking systems.[/font]





Here is the REALITY statement in the article which continues to undermine our laws and regulations:



[font=Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif]"Cities should not be in the business of making it easier for people to violate federal law even if they don't pose a security risk," he said.[/font]





http://www.latimes.c...0,3840249.story





[font=Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif]The DNC straw horse constructed to paint Republicans as anti-Immigrant are destructed when one reads these types of stories and efforts to do nothing more than ignore our borders and Federal regulations on immigration.[/font]





In my opinion, we do not need reform as much as enforcement of our current laws on the books. That stated, I am all for a reform that makes tracking individuals who get legal visas much easier, places enforcement not on the shoulders of businesses but on the Government, and allows an easier process for migrant workers needed in this nation for agriculture and manufacturing. After all, how many Americans will do the backbreaking work of picking stawberries or plucking chicken feathers?





Reform also needs to include a mechanism for quickly checking someone's immigration status on line and eliminating the ability to obtain false Social Security Numbers and live illegally in this country.
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Old September 11th, 2012, 10:58 AM   #2
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The root cause of our immigration problems is the courts. Not the current band of appointed politicians parading around as justices, but a Supreme Court decision 40 years with Plyler v. Doe. Some will attempt to argue that birthright citizenship was established in 1898 with United States v. Wong Kim Ark , but it was not, as the court skirted the "under the 14th Amendment's Citizenship Clause, specifically, "subject to the jurisdiction thereof."



Also, the court's disregarding the difference between naturalization and immigration, which was in direct conflict of the state's retaining their right of controlling immigration when ratifying the Constitution.

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Old September 11th, 2012, 03:56 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmyb View Post
The root cause of our immigration problems is the courts. Not the current band of appointed politicians parading around as justices, but a Supreme Court decision 40 years with Plyler v. Doe. Some will attempt to argue that birthright citizenship was established in 1898 with United States v. Wong Kim Ark , but it was not, as the court skirted the "under the 14th Amendment's Citizenship Clause, specifically, "subject to the jurisdiction thereof."



Also, the court's disregarding the difference between naturalization and immigration, which was in direct conflict of the state's retaining their right of controlling immigration when ratifying the Constitution.


Indeed. Mom and Pop risk deportation just so they can give the gift of US citizenship to their babies. It's understandable considering the shitty conditions south of the border. And, when their kid gets to be old enough, he or she can petition the government for a legal visa for his or her parents. It's not complicated.



If only we'd listened....



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Old September 11th, 2012, 06:04 PM   #4
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I forgot to add some reforms for the current situation we need.



Because, as shown in the above articles, Governments have CHOSEN to ignore the problem in the past, we would need a mechanism in place to provide a path to citizenship for "qualified" illegals who have been in this country for a period of time and have not broken our laws and paid their taxes.



There are millions here who entered legally and obtained SS numbers and who chose not to renew, due to fear, or not to return to their own nations. These people get jobs even in Government, have families and pay their taxes. The Government has willfully ignored them and more than happy to take their money yet not deport.
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Old September 11th, 2012, 07:11 PM   #5
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I just went through 14 months of bureaucratic hell to obtain a visa for my foreign-born wife. Even after we passed our interview, the bureaucracy didn't let up, and the very closing chapter had me saying to American embassy personnel: "Hey, I'm an American citizen, and you are the American Embassy, and you are supposed to be on my side!!!" Once I contacted the consul directly, everything smoothed out, but damn....



Talking about our immigration policy is premature. The first order of business is enforcing our "on the books" immigration laws. Reagan's amnesty was a HUGE mistake.



Allowing "anchor babies" is a HUGE mistake.



Bush's soulful soliloquies about the honest, decent, hard-working immigrants were BIG mistakes. Yet, we've got 12-20 million illegals in our country, and now, something has got to be done.



I hate the fact that these people simply immigrated illegally while my wife and I were put through the wringer, but something has to be done. Obama has done something reasonable.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 12:43 AM   #6
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There are so many problems with immigration they’re nearly impossible to list. IT spending 14 months just to obtain a visa for his wife is a great example of just one. Now multiply that by a few hundred more bizarre scenarios and you start to get the picture.



In a way it reminds me of our health care system. It is such a nonsensical patchwork of contradictory and self defeating laws that any efforts to fix it requires much more than nibbling around the edges.



But nibbling around the edges is good for getting votes, a fundamental overhaul does not.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 07:45 AM   #7
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Obama has done something reasonable.



You denigrate the statements by Bush and amnesty under Reagan then claim Obama has done something reasonable? REALLY?



I think your politics are confused and history confined to a lack of objective analysis.



Clinton did NOTHING. Obama has done NOTHING but make it easy for illegal immigrant children to have a path to eventual citizenship through executive order and make it a political re-election opportunity.



Yes IT, it's all Bush and Reagan's fault again. ::eyeroll::



You're right about one thing; what happened to you and your wife is an outrage and is probably more the norm than exception which is why a serious re-examination of our Immigration policies is due and integrating those we chose to ignore for decades since the last amnesty into our society and modernizing our guest worker and immigration system to work FOR America and not AGAINST her.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 09:43 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
Obama has done something reasonable.



You denigrate the statements by Bush and amnesty under Reagan then claim Obama has done something reasonable? REALLY?



I think your politics are confused and history confined to a lack of objective analysis.



Clinton did NOTHING. Obama has done NOTHING but make it easy for illegal immigrant children to have a path to eventual citizenship through executive order and make it a political re-election opportunity.



Yes IT, it's all Bush and Reagan's fault again. ::eyeroll::



You're right about one thing; what happened to you and your wife is an outrage and is probably more the norm than exception which is why a serious re-examination of our Immigration policies is due and integrating those we chose to ignore for decades since the last amnesty into our society and modernizing our guest worker and immigration system to work FOR America and not AGAINST her.


It's great to be right about one thing!!! lol



Reagan's amnesty was a mistake. Address that if you disagree.



Bush, during a time of war, not only left the borders wide open, he rolled out the red carpet. Address that if you disagree. Use facts to refute, please.
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Old September 12th, 2012, 11:17 AM   #9
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Reagan's amnesty was a mistake. Address that if you disagree.



Was it "Reagan's" amnesty? If so, how? I thought it was a BI-PARTISAN effort to address the massive influx of illegal aliens and the ones who were living in the country at the time.



Bush, during a time of war, not only left the borders wide open, he rolled out the red carpet. Address that if you disagree. Use facts to refute, please.



Bush left the borders wide open? How?



Bush rolled out the "red carpet?" How?



Once again we see the construction of straw horses for no other purpose than avoiding factual events.



Here is what the goal of that 1986 bill was, tell me how well the Government, States and Congress held up to that deal:



Ronald Reagan signed a sweeping immigration reform bill into law. It was sold as a crackdown: There would be tighter security at the Mexican border, and employers would face strict penalties for hiring undocumented workers.



Now we are confronting the identical issues we faced in 1986; millions living here illegally.



The 1986 act wasn't a mistake; the lack of subsequent enforcement was where the Government went wrong.



P.S. one of these days you will address the thread topic right?
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Old September 12th, 2012, 11:37 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
Reagan's amnesty was a mistake. Address that if you disagree.



Was it "Reagan's" amnesty? If so, how? I thought it was a BI-PARTISAN effort to address the massive influx of illegal aliens and the ones who were living in the country at the time.



Bush, during a time of war, not only left the borders wide open, he rolled out the red carpet. Address that if you disagree. Use facts to refute, please.



Bush left the borders wide open? How?



Bush rolled out the "red carpet?" How?



Once again we see the construction of straw horses for no other purpose than avoiding factual events.



Here is what the goal of that 1986 bill was, tell me how well the Government, States and Congress held up to that deal:



Ronald Reagan signed a sweeping immigration reform bill into law. It was sold as a crackdown: There would be tighter security at the Mexican border, and employers would face strict penalties for hiring undocumented workers.



Now we are confronting the identical issues we faced in 1986; millions living here illegally.



The 1986 act wasn't a mistake; the lack of subsequent enforcement was where the Government went wrong.



P.S. one of these days you will address the thread topic right?


The questions you ask are your straw horses. How did Bush leave the borders open, and how did he roll out the red carpet?



You must have been sound asleep when this was going on ... for years.



One of these days you'll actually discuss something and we can find where we agree, or even (gasp!) learn something from each other, instead of playing the partisan and looking for a gotcha ... I hope.
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