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Old August 13th, 2017, 03:54 AM   #21
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"Even Donald Trump...for all his bull****, knows the US can not act unilaterally against NK." DD #19
There is no force in Heaven or on Earth to prevent it.
The U.S.' sovereign right to counter-attack when attacked is not curtailed by the enemy crossing the nuclear rubicon.
Quote:
"Even Donald Trump knows that China is the key." DD
And all the valuables in your State's bank vaults are the key to your personal wealth.

So what?

They're not going to give it all to you.
And China isn't going to work against its own interests either.

If China did as the U.S. & West want, NK would become marginalized, and closer to failure, collapse.
That would lay the NK territory open to assimilation by SK, as West Germany did with East Germany after The Wall fell.

That in turn would put a Western friendly nation, a U.S.-friendly nation directly on China's border.
China extremely does not want that.

Each of the primaries here:
- The U.S.
- South Korea
- North Korea (to their own twisted way of thinking), and
- China

are each acting in their own self-interest.
BUT !! Because they're different interests, there are different methods to realizing them.

China is quite unlikely to do the bidding of the U.S. in this regard.
The most likely reason China would consider it would be if China thought by so doing it could prevent a nuclear war on its own border.

So far China seems to be hanging firm.
Quote:
"Now it's time for the King of the Deal...the Deal Maker in chief to get off his lard ass and negotiate with China to see that UN sanctions are pressed to the limit to really hurt Kim Jong Un."
Not sure you had this in mind or not.
But Donald Trump is nowhere near the hot-shot he imagines himself to be.
With law suits, trickery, outfight fraud (refusing to pay workers what they've earned), and bankruptcy, Trump may have managed to obtain for himself a petit empire.

But Trump has already showed his hand.
- I'm gunna build a wall
- it's gunna be a great wall
- Mexico's gunna pay for it ...

Bull Spit !!

Trump is a trash-talkin' NYC fool. He's out of his league.
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Old August 13th, 2017, 04:00 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by titan View Post
There is no force in Heaven or on Earth to prevent it.
The U.S.' sovereign right to counter-attack when attacked is not curtailed by the enemy crossing the nuclear rubicon.

And all the valuables in your State's bank vaults are the key to your personal wealth.

So what?

They're not going to give it all to you.
And China isn't going to work against its own interests either.

If China did as the U.S. & West want, NK would become marginalized, and closer to failure, collapse.
That would lay the NK territory open to assimilation by SK, as West Germany did with East Germany after The Wall fell.

That in turn would put a Western friendly nation, a U.S.-friendly nation directly on China's border.
China extremely does not want that.

Each of the primaries here:
- The U.S.
- South Korea
- North Korea (to their own twisted way of thinking), and
- China

are each acting in their own self-interest.
BUT !! Because they're different interests, there are different methods to realizing them.

China is quite unlikely to do the bidding of the U.S. in this regard.
The most likely reason China would consider it would be if China thought by so doing it could prevent a nuclear war on its own border.

So far China seems to be hanging firm.

Not sure you had this in mind or not.
But Donald Trump is nowhere near the hot-shot he imagines himself to be.
With law suits, trickery, outfight fraud (refusing to pay workers what they've earned), and bankruptcy, Trump may have managed to obtain for himself a petit empire.

But Trump has already showed his hand.
- I'm gunna build a wall
- it's gunna be a great wall
- Mexico's gunna pay for it ...

Bull Spit !!

Trump is a trash-talkin' NYC fool. He's out of his league.
zap gook
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Old August 13th, 2017, 07:00 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Sabcat View Post
From the poster who is consistently interjecting and is almost never on topic or even attempting to contribute to move the conversation forward.


Ripe sweetie...absolutely ripe.
Blah-blah-blah-blah...
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Old August 13th, 2017, 07:01 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by Twisted Sister View Post
Trump should say. "One round expended, bore clear and no casualties." Time of flight 18 minutes.
No, because he would not know what that meant.
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Old August 13th, 2017, 07:40 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by roastpork View Post
OK Marine, it is Idiotic because what he says is exactly what we have been doing since the end of the Korean War. We have negotiated and appeased North Korea so that now it's a nuclear power, a nuclear power in the hands of a megalomaniac who wants to eliminate South Korea, and establish his own basketball league, probably with Rodman as commissioner.


Well, thanks, Captain Obvious! It's idiotic to negotiate? If that's the case then every reasonable world leader in the history of the planet seems to be an idiot.

Just exactly what WERE we supposed to do? What were all those presidents supposed to do with North Korea, because there are only so many options before people start to die, but I suppose that's okay with you.
Bully-in-Chief would shut his pie hole and let Tillerson and McMasters manage this hot mess because every stinkin' time Trump opens his blabby mouth he makes another blunder. Little Kimmie LOVES this propaganda--he spreads it around his country like butter.
I suppose there are those who say "what about assassination"? Then WHO FILLS THE VOID? Another little Kimmie?
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Old August 13th, 2017, 09:11 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clara007 View Post
Well, thanks, Captain Obvious! It's idiotic to negotiate? If that's the case then every reasonable world leader in the history of the planet seems to be an idiot.

Just exactly what WERE we supposed to do? What were all those presidents supposed to do with North Korea, because there are only so many options before people start to die, but I suppose that's okay with you.
Bully-in-Chief would shut his pie hole and let Tillerson and McMasters manage this hot mess because every stinkin' time Trump opens his blabby mouth he makes another blunder. Little Kimmie LOVES this propaganda--he spreads it around his country like butter.
I suppose there are those who say "what about assassination"? Then WHO FILLS THE VOID? Another little Kimmie?
We do exactly what Trump is doing, by bringing pressure on China and putting a military response in close proximity. Negotiations have failed, that is obvious! The only response psychopaths respond to is force. Neville Chamberlain and England would attest to that.
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Old August 13th, 2017, 02:23 PM   #27
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Slick Willie negotiated with the Kims....How'd that work out??... You think for one minute that the ayatollahs in Iran are not watching this??...Thank you Obama for being as feckless and stupid as Clinton....Another mess that Trump will have to clean up...
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Old August 13th, 2017, 04:14 PM   #28
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It seems that a country like the U.S. that invades other countries leads to those other countries wanting nukes as a security strategy against such imperialistic enemies. Go figure.
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Old August 13th, 2017, 07:30 PM   #29
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I haven't reviewed any updated classified briefing material on it.

BUT !!

I gather NK has at least one submarine.
Whether it can launch a missile or not I don't know.

But at this point, particularly with China as a wild card;
the Trump administration may already be past the point of painless solution.

Obviously if Trump could simply nuke Pyongyang, dust his own hands off: - job well done-
and then get in a round of golf before lunch; SPLENDID.

BUT !!

If Trump tries devastating / debilitating military preemption here, hundreds of thousands might be lost:
- Seoul for near certain, and
- lord knows how much more harm in Japan.

Of course the U.S. nuclear triad has awesome reserve military power.
But that awesome military power is disbursed wisely around the planet.

NK, the hermit kingdom lacks that geographic diversity.

BUT !!

If China holds a few surprises for NK defense in reserve, potential combat w/ NK could mean loss of innocent life in the millions.

a) That's a rather obvious problem.

BUT !!

b) It could be vastly, vastly, vastly worse than most might imagine.

For if the idea gets loose that being a ally of the United States can cut your population in half, the U.S. could start to lose trading partners, allies; and effectively become isolated; a global pariah.

Trump has a tiger by the tail here.

I only hope Secretaries Tillerson and Mattis can persuade President Etch-a-sketch not to set human history back generations; something well within President Trump's power.

Don't believe me?
Nuke Pyongyang, watch, and learn.
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Old August 13th, 2017, 07:39 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimgorn View Post
Slick Willie negotiated with the Kims....How'd that work out??... You think for one minute that the ayatollahs in Iran are not watching this??...Thank you Obama for being as feckless and stupid as Clinton....Another mess that Trump will have to clean up...
And another conservative, in their zeal tp blame it all on the democrats, neglects to mention that the great Shrub MADE THE SAME FUCKING DEAL WITH NK !!!!!!!! How'd THAT fucking work out for us HUH ??
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