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Old January 4th, 2018, 07:18 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by Athena View Post
"Respect" be understood in different ways. However, the effect of being disrespectful is the same and that is not good when we look at the bigger picture. A society that agrees it is okay to be disrespectful, will be disrespectful, and this is a great lead into discussing the issue of this thread.

It appears your brother-in-law was very disrespectful to you, and I assume your husband did not defend you, leaving in a position to defend yourself? When I mentioned to a therapist my displeasure in my husband because he did not defend me, when his brother was disrespecting me, HE said it sounded like I did a good job of defending myself. HIS analysis of the situation was not helpful and I think it was a mistake to be consulting with a male at that time in our history when it was the norm to belittle women and disrespect them, and to be sexual predators. Our past is not all good and many of us are very resentful today, and this resentment is surfacing, and that is why we have this thread. But is being unaware of our resentment and glad to dump it on men we do not know, a good idea? Even if they "deserve it"?

What goes around comes around, and is being resentful and disrepectful something we want coming our way? Is this negativity going to make things better?

Respect can be understood as a virtue that you practice or do not. Look it up.
Sorry Athena, but I never felt that I needed a man to defend me from an uneducated idiot who constantly left himself open to verbal body slamming.

There is a difference between treating someone with disrespect automatically, and reacting to disrespect.

I treat everyone with respect and consideration right up to the time that they prove that they do not deserve it.
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Old January 4th, 2018, 07:19 AM   #112
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Yes, I'm afraid I am JUST as passionate about racism....and I WAS a union leader so YEP--you betcha. I'm pretty much a bleeding heart. LOL

Good morning Clara, now that I am recharged and my head is working it has dawned on me, you probably don't see a problem with feminism because you are well balanced and appear to be pleased with your life. Also, you are an activist and like me, think if something is wrong, it is our responsibility to fix it. It can be hard for us to comprehend people who insist on being the problem.

It is just that I don't think this thread is attacking our principles, but the fact that some people have made themselves a problem. I chose to be a full-time wife and mother, and myself esteem requires I value that, and I don't see that coming from prominent feminists. When the speak of having children, it is what they add to lives, not what they devote their lives too, and I think there is a serious difference that affects the whole of our society.

Darn, now I am out of time! Quickly, I researched middle-age females when working on a degree in gerontology, and learned those of us who went from being good daughters to good wives and mothers, speak a domestic language and the professional languages and frame of mind can be very foreign to us. This can make getting a degree difficult, not because we have a low IQ but we speak and think in a different language.

It is not just a difference in our heads, but our whole bodies. Every cell in our bodies reacts to our sense of right and wrong. Some people can leave their child in the care of others and be very glad they can do this, because what they want to do is follow a career path. On the other hand, some of us find it very difficult to leave our children in the care of others and we may have a lot of anxiety and guilt when we do that. I stress this is a body thing, not just a head thing. It is about the values we grew up with, and what we feel is right and wrong, and it might be important to society that a number of women retain this primitive instinct? My mother worked and supported her children without the help of a husband, and I really wanted my children to have a traditional family and a full-time mother! When professional women speak of this as men did in the past, that is nice but clearly inferior to having a career, it is very offensive! Maybe we can talk more about this later, I really have to run.
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Old January 4th, 2018, 07:23 AM   #113
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I hope you put that one in the win column.
Oh yes.
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Old January 4th, 2018, 07:51 AM   #114
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Good morning Clara, now that I am recharged and my head is working it has dawned on me, you probably don't see a problem with feminism because you are well balanced and appear to be pleased with your life. Also, you are an activist and like me, think if something is wrong, it is our responsibility to fix it. It can be hard for us to comprehend people who insist on being the problem.

It is just that I don't think this thread is attacking our principles, but the fact that some people have made themselves a problem. I chose to be a full-time wife and mother, and myself esteem requires I value that, and I don't see that coming from prominent feminists. When the speak of having children, it is what they add to lives, not what they devote their lives too, and I think there is a serious difference that affects the whole of our society.

Darn, now I am out of time! Quickly, I researched middle-age females when working on a degree in gerontology, and learned those of us who went from being good daughters to good wives and mothers, speak a domestic language and the professional languages and frame of mind can be very foreign to us. This can make getting a degree difficult, not because we have a low IQ but we speak and think in a different language.

It is not just a difference in our heads, but our whole bodies. Every cell in our bodies reacts to our sense of right and wrong. Some people can leave their child in the care of others and be very glad they can do this, because what they want to do is follow a career path. On the other hand, some of us find it very difficult to leave our children in the care of others and we may have a lot of anxiety and guilt when we do that. I stress this is a body thing, not just a head thing. It is about the values we grew up with, and what we feel is right and wrong, and it might be important to society that a number of women retain this primitive instinct? My mother worked and supported her children without the help of a husband, and I really wanted my children to have a traditional family and a full-time mother! When professional women speak of this as men did in the past, that is nice but clearly inferior to having a career, it is very offensive! Maybe we can talk more about this later, I really have to run.
I also decided to be a full time mom. (I did take the occasional part time job when the kids were older)

I found that I got the 'oh, so you don't work' from women as much as I did from men.

The women I never got that attitude from were the ones who freely admitted that they wished they could afford to stay home with their children and still be able to support them.

The most hostile women were the ones who could have afforded to stay home if they had just been willing to make a few changes in their lives. I'm talking about things like vacations, expensive vs. moderate homes, upper end vehicles etc. It was very obvious that these women were projecting their own insecurities on to me. I was polite about it at first. Then I wasn't.
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Old January 4th, 2018, 08:29 AM   #115
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Then there's no problem.
That they are "ruining society" is a biased personal opinion of yours.
You're married to someone that thinks like you so how exactly is your life, your marriage being "ruined?"
Nonsense and I showed exactly how, if you do not agree climb back into your mangina!
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Old January 4th, 2018, 08:33 AM   #116
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Nonsense and I showed exactly how, if you do not agree climb back into your mangina!
No, you showed me nothing. You offered some biased personal opinions and whined about "society being ruined", basic nonsense. I asked you very specific questions.

I'm not 10 years old, I have no idea in the world how to "climb back into a mangina.' Talk like a rational adult to me or not at all. I do not suffer fools easily.
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Old January 4th, 2018, 08:34 AM   #117
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Ridiculous religious nonsense. The U.S. is not a theocracy. If a couple chooses of their own free will to live that way together then that is their business.
BUT, U.S. secular law involving civil rights, property rights, employment, etc. etc. must supersede and take precedence over any of that "God says" nonsense.
Hell, EVERY religion's Holy Book claims to be the "word of God."
I was asked to show what I meant so I did, if you do not agree I don't care. See, the constitution guarantees me the ability to worship, and believe how I see fit. Same goes for you, in my experience the way I live now is far better than how I lived prior. It doesn't matter top me that you disagree live like a heathen, I don't care.
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Old January 4th, 2018, 08:35 AM   #118
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No, you showed me nothing. You offered some biased personal opinions and whined about "society being ruined", basic nonsense. I asked you very specific questions.

I'm not 10 years old, I have no idea in the world how to "climb back into a mangina.' Talk like a rational adult to me or not at all. I do not suffer fools easily.
If you understood rational I would!
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Old January 4th, 2018, 08:36 AM   #119
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If you understood rational I would!
Bullshit.
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Old January 4th, 2018, 08:37 AM   #120
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I also decided to be a full time mom. (I did take the occasional part time job when the kids were older)

I found that I got the 'oh, so you don't work' from women as much as I did from men.

The women I never got that attitude from were the ones who freely admitted that they wished they could afford to stay home with their children and still be able to support them.

The most hostile women were the ones who could have afforded to stay home if they had just been willing to make a few changes in their lives. I'm talking about things like vacations, expensive vs. moderate homes, upper end vehicles etc. It was very obvious that these women were projecting their own insecurities on to me. I was polite about it at first. Then I wasn't.

Oh I can well relate to everything you just said there.
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