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Old January 11th, 2018, 08:46 PM   #41
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As you know, the majority of Americans could not - and can't - stand the loony and his loony supporters. The will of the people, if it exists, is expressed by the majority of that people, as you know.
The United States is a Republic. Not a pure Democracy. The electoral college is there to protect all the states from allowing a few large city area's to elect a president. Therefore 4 states out of 50 can not decide the presidential election.
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Old January 11th, 2018, 09:27 PM   #42
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The United States is a Republic. Not a pure Democracy. The electoral college is there to protect all the states from allowing a few large city area's to elect a president. Therefore 4 states out of 50 can not decide the presidential election.
Right! The United States just tries to tell everyone else they have to be democracies...and democracies by US standards or they could be subject of the next regime change operation.

Let's go back in time to all this Founding Fathers hoopla and bs: the electoral college is there for the same reason that only property-owning white male citizens were allowed to vote back then, and Senators were State-appointees. They wanted rule by the landowning mostly slaveowning class and they wanted to keep it that way.
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Old January 11th, 2018, 10:07 PM   #43
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Who's Oprah?
Obama's aunt, on his dads side.
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Old January 12th, 2018, 02:41 AM   #44
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The United States is a Republic. Not a pure Democracy. The electoral college is there to protect all the states from allowing a few large city area's to elect a president. Therefore 4 states out of 50 can not decide the presidential election.
The Electoral College is part of a deal to preserve the institution of slavery.
And to remove the incentive to allow women and minorities and poor white trash to vote.

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Old January 12th, 2018, 11:05 PM   #45
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Right! The United States just tries to tell everyone else they have to be democracies...and democracies by US standards or they could be subject of the next regime change operation.
Yeah ok, back to the electoral college
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Let's go back in time to all this Founding Fathers hoopla and bs: the electoral college is there for the same reason that only property-owning white male citizens were allowed to vote back then, and Senators were State-appointees. They wanted rule by the landowning mostly slaveowning class and they wanted to keep it that way.
No its not. Its not even a good comparison. It was put in place in order to keep a few large populous areas from electing the president and the voice of the rest of the nation not being heard.
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The Electoral College is part of a deal to preserve the institution of slavery.
And to remove the incentive to allow women and minorities and poor white trash to vote.
That is the ramblings of a sore loser. It had nothing to do with preserving the institution of slavery. Slavery was not even a serious thought at that time. Incentive of women and minorities? Hell they could not even vote at that time. Had nothing to do with the electoral college. The electoral college was designed to keep a few large states from dictating the presidency to the rest of the nation. It worked then and it works now.


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Last edited by guy39; January 12th, 2018 at 11:12 PM.
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Old January 12th, 2018, 11:12 PM   #46
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Old January 13th, 2018, 03:44 AM   #47
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she would win she could lose. either way like Trump she is more Qualified than Hillary ever was.
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Old January 13th, 2018, 05:17 AM   #48
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The United States is a Republic. Not a pure Democracy. The electoral college is there to protect all the states from allowing a few large city area's to elect a president. Therefore 4 states out of 50 can not decide the presidential election.
I know. But don't ever tell us about the Will of the American People. Heil Trump!
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Old January 13th, 2018, 08:49 AM   #49
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Yeah ok, back to the electoral college

No its not. Its not even a good comparison. It was put in place in order to keep a few large populous areas from electing the president and the voice of the rest of the nation not being heard.
What you're giving here is an argument for keeping the Electoral College/not why these FF's wanted an indirect voting system for president! If we go back to the beginning:
Quote:
Article II, Section 1, Clause 3 of the Constitution provided the original plan by which the electors chose the president and vice president. Under the original plan, the candidate who received a majority of votes from the electors would become president; the candidate receiving the second most votes would become vice president.

The original plan of the Electoral College was based upon several assumptions and anticipations of the Framers of the Constitution:[26]

Individual electors would be elected by citizens on a district-by-district basis.[27]
Each presidential elector would exercise independent judgment when voting.
Candidates would not pair together on the same ticket with assumed placements toward each office of president and vice president.
The system as designed would rarely produce a winner, thus sending the election to Congress.


According to the text of Article II, however, each state government was free to have its own plan for selecting its electors, and the Constitution does not explicitly require states to popularly elect their electors. Several different methods for selecting electors are described at length below.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electo...#Original_plan

Now, I did mention back when this was a hot...at least rhetorically hot issue(DNC has obviously done nothing about having their election "stolen")that the problem that would arise if the EC was simply abolished would be the kind of big state dominance that parliamentary systems (like Canada) have experienced with the two biggest provinces being the only playground of national elections. When Justin Trudeau's father was Prime Minister, he and previous Liberal leaders had an almost guaranteed lock on Parliamentary majority as long as they made sure they won the majority of ridings(seats) in Ontario and Quebec. This calculus started to get messed up a bit when large internal migrations found eastern Canadians moving west to Alberta and BC....making it necessary to award them with more seats in Parliament with each census, while seats were taken away from losing provinces like Quebec and especially Maritime provinces.

So, in all, you could have a state balancing system without the mumbo jumbo buraucracy of electing members to an electoral college. Recall that this last time, there was at least one Republican elector...a former congressman who declared that he was voting for Trump no matter what! That caused outrage and fits in the media, but as it says above, if he did vote for and push his state over the line for Trump in spite of a voting majority for Clinton, there wouldn't be a damn thing anyone could do about it, cause that's the way the process is written!

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That is the ramblings of a sore loser. It had nothing to do with preserving the institution of slavery. Slavery was not even a serious thought at that time. Incentive of women and minorities? Hell they could not even vote at that time. Had nothing to do with the electoral college. The electoral college was designed to keep a few large states from dictating the presidency to the rest of the nation. It worked then and it works now.
Ever since the end of the Civil War right up to the present day, both south and north/Dems and Repubs in the US and their liberal and conservative backers have been working in a combined effort to talk down the importance of slavery in America as a social, political and economic institution! A few black academics are the only ones pushing back...beginning with CLR James and WEB DeBois to Edward Baptiste today(The Half That Was Never Told) focusing on the economic impact of slavery on the entire nation of the USA and other beneficiaries like England..who abolished slavery in its own colonies. And more recently, Prof Gerald Horne has written "The Counter-revolution of 1776" as a tonic to demythologize America's founding and present a case that the FF's were mostly landowning and slaveholding oligarchs who were revolting(not against taxes)but the mother country's decision that escaped slaves could not be returned to their masters and no slavery would be allowed any longer in other colonies in the Americas.
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Old January 13th, 2018, 08:51 AM   #50
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she would win she could lose. either way like Trump she is more Qualified than Hillary ever was.
What a bizarre and completely illogical statement.
Why do you say such silly things?
Have you no sense of shame whatsoever?
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