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Old January 12th, 2018, 03:18 PM   #41
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So OK. You have a case before the courts. You've been sued by your neighbor. You lost the original case and there is a judgement against you. Now, you are absolutely convinced that you have done nothing wrong and believe you have the evidence to ultimately prevail, so you have filed an appeal. It may take weeks, months, even years for that case to wind it's way through the courts.

While the suit is making it's way through the courts, do you think your neighbor has the right to call the local sheriff, show up at your home or work and DEMAND PAYMENT of that judgement WHILE it's still under appeal ??

OF COURSE NOT. You don't have to pay until the courts have denied your last appeal. If you don't believe me, look into the Exxon Valdez case. It took 19 years for the suit to make it's way to SCOTUS and then they cut the punitive damages down to 1/10th of what the jury had ordered. But 19 years !!!! If they set aside money to pay damages, it likely earned more in interest than they finally paid !!

This is exactly the situation the DACA kids are in. Trump has said he's ending the program. OK that may well be within his rights as president. However, NO COURT has yet ruled the original DACA program UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

The constitution prohibits Ex Post Facto laws. If something was legal when you did it, but the government later decides to make it illegal, they CAN NOT make the law retroactive. They CAN NOT punish you for something that was legal when you did it.

Trump maybe able to end the program, no longer allowing new applicants. But until the courts say the original program was unconstitutional, anyone currently protected under DACA remain protected until the court cases are over.

What this judge did IS NOT LEGAL ACTIVISM. IT'S BLACK LETTER CONSTITUTIONAL LAW !!!

Some of you are absolutely hilarious. You practically threw a party every time Obama got overturned. But let you boy lose one and it's OMG JUDICIAL ACTIVISM !! LOLOLOLOL
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Old January 12th, 2018, 05:44 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by tristanrobin View Post
yay! good for the judge!

these children and young adults and students should not be being punished for the actions of their parents.

we do not (supposedly) visit the sins upon the father
If they are NOW ADULTS and KNOW they are here illegally, IT IS A RESULT OF THEIR ACTION.

if you are 18 and your parents brought you to the US illegally, YOU ARE WILLING VIOLATING FEDERAL LAWS. if they are under 18, maybe. But the day they turn 18 THEY ARE RESPONSIBLE to leave the country and return legally.

That is like saying the Son of the Mafia boss when he takes control of the Mafia isn't committing a crimes because "His parents were criminals they entered that lifestyle not their fault.

Last edited by TNVolunteer73; January 12th, 2018 at 05:46 PM.
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Old January 12th, 2018, 06:42 PM   #43
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That is like saying the Son of the Mafia boss when he takes control of the Mafia isn't committing a crimes because "His parents were criminals they entered that lifestyle not their fault.
No, if your parents bring you to a country which you grow up in and is your home and you remain there it is NOT the same thing as engaging in organized crime family activity.

To suggest it's the same is absolutely asinine.
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Old January 12th, 2018, 07:01 PM   #44
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No, if your parents bring you to a country which you grow up in and is your home and you remain there it is NOT the same thing as engaging in organized crime family activity.

To suggest it's the same is absolutely asinine.
when I turn 18 I am just as guilty of the crime as the parents. Yes it is organized, you know you are here illegally and when you enter into the collusion that is an organized effort to continue violating the law.
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Old January 13th, 2018, 06:46 AM   #45
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blah blah blah

you're being obstinate and ridiculous
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Old January 13th, 2018, 07:12 AM   #46
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when I turn 18 I am just as guilty of the crime as the parents. Yes it is organized, you know you are here illegally and when you enter into the collusion that is an organized effort to continue violating the law.

So....basically...guilt by association? Or some form of it? Their parents broke the law, ergo the kids broke the law??

Have you even educated yourself on the DACA issue?? Do you know WHY these unauthorized young people don't become citizens--haven't become citizens??

Unauthorized immigrants generally have no way to “become legalized” — which is why some advocates have called for an overhaul of U.S. immigration laws to create a path to citizenship.
Foreign nationals must first be granted a green card — or legal permanent residency — before they can apply for citizenship. Most unauthorized immigrants don’t qualify for green cards, and for non-citizens who are eligible for green cards, the waits can be decades long.

The majority of green card holders have to wait five years before they can even apply for citizenship. Those who are married to U.S. citizens can apply three years after they receive their green cards.

So what are they supposed to do? They are in citizenship purgatory. Do you support sending an 18-year-old kid back to El Salvador? Honduras? A place they have never lived--no home--no job--no money--just HEY--we'll drop you at the bus stop??

Trump did a stupid stupid thing, which is not surprising. He reversed DACA without a solution....without a pathway to citizenship.
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Old January 13th, 2018, 09:15 AM   #47
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So....basically...guilt by association? Or some form of it? Their parents broke the law, ergo the kids broke the law??

<snip>
It's original sin. Someone has to be crucified to save them.
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Old January 13th, 2018, 09:38 AM   #48
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So....basically...guilt by association? Or some form of it? Their parents broke the law, ergo the kids broke the law??

Have you even educated yourself on the DACA issue?? Do you know WHY these unauthorized young people don't become citizens--haven't become citizens??

Unauthorized immigrants generally have no way to “become legalized” — which is why some advocates have called for an overhaul of U.S. immigration laws to create a path to citizenship.
Foreign nationals must first be granted a green card — or legal permanent residency — before they can apply for citizenship. Most unauthorized immigrants don’t qualify for green cards, and for non-citizens who are eligible for green cards, the waits can be decades long.

The majority of green card holders have to wait five years before they can even apply for citizenship. Those who are married to U.S. citizens can apply three years after they receive their green cards.

So what are they supposed to do? They are in citizenship purgatory. Do you support sending an 18-year-old kid back to El Salvador? Honduras? A place they have never lived--no home--no job--no money--just HEY--we'll drop you at the bus stop??

Trump did a stupid stupid thing, which is not surprising. He reversed DACA without a solution....without a pathway to citizenship.
When that child turns 18 they begin to accrue unlawful presence, at which point the length of unlawful presence will determine the length of being banned from entry into the US if they ever get deported, that ban being from 3 years to life. DACA status doesn't count towards unlawful presence as long as they have DACA status.

Their countries should have services that help them to adapt. Children and adults uproot all the time and move, it is nothing new. DACA was given a phase out time, it wasn't reversed without a solution. Congress should have dealt with it when Democrats had full control, they chose to punt the ball.
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Old January 13th, 2018, 09:43 AM   #49
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When that child turns 18 they begin to accrue unlawful presence, at which point the length of unlawful presence will determine the length of being banned from entry into the US if they ever get deported, that ban being from 3 years to life. DACA status doesn't count towards unlawful presence as long as they have DACA status.

Their countries should have services that help them to adapt. Children and adults uproot all the time and move, it is nothing new. DACA was given a phase out time, it wasn't reversed without a solution. Congress should have dealt with it when Democrats had full control, they chose to punt the ball.
Congress should deal with it now.
That's what they get paid to do.
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Old January 13th, 2018, 09:48 AM   #50
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Congress should deal with it now.
That's what they get paid to do.
That's what they are trying to do, but they all whine because they don't get their way. Both sides play politics with it, why didn't them Dems pass it cleanly when they had total control of Congress and the White House? Why did they punt it?

Personally, I say apply the actual laws of the land and remove the illegals, allow them to apply form their home nations for appropriate entry visas, and if they get caught overstaying their visa or improper entry again, 2 - 10 years in jail.
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