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Old July 10th, 2018, 08:05 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Citizen Kane View Post
Indeed, and any American not backing President Trump on this is a fool.





About the author:
Matthieu Borsboom, a former vice admiral of the Royal Netherlands Navy, is Burson-Marstellerís senior adviser for defense and security.



https://www.politico.eu/article/nato...st-spend-more/
I'll give Trump his due when he calls for abolishing NATO! Since it has had no clear defined purpose since the Cold War ended and the Soviet Union disintegrated into 15 separate nations.

And yet, NATO continues on...gathers more and more members, right up to Russia's borders today, and serves as the international legitimization figleaf every time the US goes on a regime change junket around the world....Iraq, Libya and on and on.

So, that's what you're paying for with NATO, and if he pulls the plug on it, the EU members can reframe their militaries as the European Union Force Merkel and others have offered up.
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Old July 10th, 2018, 08:23 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by right to left View Post
I'll give Trump his due when he calls for abolishing NATO! Since it has had no clear defined purpose since the Cold War ended and the Soviet Union disintegrated into 15 separate nations.

And yet, NATO continues on...gathers more and more members, right up to Russia's borders today, and serves as the international legitimization figleaf every time the US goes on a regime change junket around the world....Iraq, Libya and on and on.

So, that's what you're paying for with NATO, and if he pulls the plug on it, the EU members can reframe their militaries as the European Union Force Merkel and others have offered up.
Wow, sounds like you are a Russian bot. Did you see any problem with Russia invading Crimea or can that be easily explained away ?
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Old July 10th, 2018, 08:26 AM   #13
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If Trump explained that NATO doesn't have any reason for existing since the USSR is "gone", that might carry some water. But that's not what he's doing. What he's doing is snowflaking that he thinks they don't spend enough money on military. This coming from an imbecile increasing the USA's already bloated military expenditures.
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Old July 10th, 2018, 09:00 AM   #14
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Wow, sounds like you are a Russian bot. Did you see any problem with Russia invading Crimea or can that be easily explained away ?
Russia didn't "invade" Crimea to start with. Crimea only became a part of Ukraine back in 1954, at a time when Soviet president Kruschev decided to hand it over to the Ukraine from Russia...even though the majority of the population was Russian! Go learn some history for once!

This was likely because Kruschev didn't want to bother building a bridge to link Russia with the Crimean Peninsula...who's only land link was a narrow passage to the Ukraine. But at that time, these republic borders were little more than bookkeeping entries! Since the republican governments had little power compared to regional Soviet administrators that represented the wishes of the Politburo in Moscow.

It only became an issue after the collapse of the Soviet Union, when Ukraine announced it was taking over the naval base in Sevastopol. Even during the disarray and deprivations going on in the Yeltsin years, Russia declared it to be an act of war and the Clinton Administration told the Ukrainians to cool their jets on the early orange revolution ideas.

After the Orange Revolution of 2011 led to an uprising supported by the US Government and led to the dissolution of the Parliament, the new interim leaders declared their intentions to scrap the agreements with Russia regarding administering Crimea. That led to an uprising of its own in Crimea and demands for independence and rejoining Russia. Though Russia sweetened the pot offering better pensions than the Ukraine Gov was providing, and other economic measures...including building that bridge!

So, learn some history for once, instead of just regurgitating whatever stupid shit Maddow and her guests say on these issues. I don't even believe that this new Nazified Ukraine nationalist regime has a legitimate claim to the Donbass region in the east...which is mostly Russian speaking and have made their intentions clear also that they don't recognize the governments in Kiev.

Even back when Ukraine was holding a government together prior to the uprising, the division of seats in parliament clearly show the divide between west and east in the country. Prior to 2011, the US was interested in holding the country together and preventing it's breakup...as was Russia if you want to be honest about it. They may have wanted to have Crimea back as part of Russia, but there is no clear reason why they would want Donetsk or Lugansk - poor, ecologically degraded zones of antiquated heavy industry and coal mining. Even now, Russia supports their independence, but doesn't want to incorporate these territories and their debts and huge needs for economic redevelopment. But, at least their doing better than the Nazis on the other side of the fence!
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Old July 10th, 2018, 09:08 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by right to left View Post
Russia didn't "invade" Crimea to start with. Crimea only became a part of Ukraine back in 1954, at a time when Soviet president Kruschev decided to hand it over to the Ukraine from Russia...even though the majority of the population was Russian! Go learn some history for once!

This was likely because Kruschev didn't want to bother building a bridge to link Russia with the Crimean Peninsula...who's only land link was a narrow passage to the Ukraine. But at that time, these republic borders were little more than bookkeeping entries! Since the republican governments had little power compared to regional Soviet administrators that represented the wishes of the Politburo in Moscow.

It only became an issue after the collapse of the Soviet Union, when Ukraine announced it was taking over the naval base in Sevastopol. Even during the disarray and deprivations going on in the Yeltsin years, Russia declared it to be an act of war and the Clinton Administration told the Ukrainians to cool their jets on the early orange revolution ideas.

After the Orange Revolution of 2011 led to an uprising supported by the US Government and led to the dissolution of the Parliament, the new interim leaders declared their intentions to scrap the agreements with Russia regarding administering Crimea. That led to an uprising of its own in Crimea and demands for independence and rejoining Russia. Though Russia sweetened the pot offering better pensions than the Ukraine Gov was providing, and other economic measures...including building that bridge!

So, learn some history for once, instead of just regurgitating whatever stupid shit Maddow and her guests say on these issues. I don't even believe that this new Nazified Ukraine nationalist regime has a legitimate claim to the Donbass region in the east...which is mostly Russian speaking and have made their intentions clear also that they don't recognize the governments in Kiev.

Even back when Ukraine was holding a government together prior to the uprising, the division of seats in parliament clearly show the divide between west and east in the country. Prior to 2011, the US was interested in holding the country together and preventing it's breakup...as was Russia if you want to be honest about it. They may have wanted to have Crimea back as part of Russia, but there is no clear reason why they would want Donetsk or Lugansk - poor, ecologically degraded zones of antiquated heavy industry and coal mining. Even now, Russia supports their independence, but doesn't want to incorporate these territories and their debts and huge needs for economic redevelopment. But, at least their doing better than the Nazis on the other side of the fence!
Has someone hijacked your account? This is just off the rails.
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Old July 10th, 2018, 09:14 AM   #16
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How much of this particular rant of Dot Don is because an increase in military expenditures of NATO members is mostly going to be going to the US MIC?

I almost wish they do but they buy Eurofighters, Canadian armored vehicles, UK bombers and German rifles.

I bet he'd still whine like the snivelling little weenie he is.
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Old July 10th, 2018, 04:22 PM   #17
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Our glorious German ally! Good grief, and RNG with the Russian trolling on top of everything.

Quote:
Germanyís soldiers forced to use BROOMSTICK for a gun as Donald Trump blasts Angela Merkel over NATO spending

...

And a spokesperson for the Defence Ministry stated: "In the case of the Boxer armoured vehicle, it was being used as a mobile headquarters, and a weapon is not foreseen and not necessary for a mobile headquarters.

"It was not a fighting vehicle. So we have no explanation why the soldiers would simulate a weapon."

In 2015 it also emerged the German military was using ordinary civilian Mercedes vans as stand-ins for armoured personnel carriers.

And The Times today reports all six of the country's submarines were recently put out of service at the same time due to various repairs.

Andreas Krause, the German navy's inspector, said: "It does not frustrate me but it is very annoying.

...



The paper added that there have been times recently when the country has not a single A400M transport plane available for use.

And in May the Luftwaffe had only four Eurofighter jets available from a total of 128 because of missile and coolant shortages.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/674356...ence-spending/
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Old July 10th, 2018, 04:26 PM   #18
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Don the Con is a clown. The world has no respect for him. Europe understands that we are experiencing a temporary problem that will eventually go away.


Russian troll alert. Tear down, tear down, tear down.
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Old July 10th, 2018, 04:28 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Hollywood View Post
Your posted article says the trend was reversed starting in 2015. Trump was not President in 2015, Obama was. Why give him credit? The process had already begun.

I know you aren't very bright, but you wear it like a badge of honor.

Quote:
Now we have 29 members, but the U.S. spends around 72 percent of NATO’s total defense budget.
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Old July 10th, 2018, 04:37 PM   #20
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Your posted article says the trend was reversed starting in 2015. Trump was not President in 2015, Obama was. Why give him credit? The process had already begun.
Downward trend was ALSO under Obama.
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