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Old October 17th, 2017, 09:55 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Supposn View Post
Right to left, equivocating? Really?
Did you bother to read what was proposed?
What specific fault did you find with a proposal for a general sales tax of 4.55% to replace reduction of taxes upon wages and payrolls from 15.3% to 6.2%?
Respectfully, Supposn
Yes I did! But you should know red flags go up immediately when you begin a proposal with:"Sales taxes are not particularly regressive."
Your link is just to another thread you started here, not outside source material. And in that post, I can't directly address a declarative statement like:"FICA and SECA are our most regressive federal taxes.
without knowing how many lower income Americans qualify for the Earned Income Tax Credit...which as I recall was major part of Mitt Romney's stupid pushback against the Occupy movements focus on the top 1% of income earners--'47% of the American public are TAKERS' and that was the end of his useless campaign in 2012!

You need to explain how reducing "taxes upon wages and payrolls from 15.3% to 6.2%" will benefit the majority of people when there is no breakdown along income, and how adding a national sales tax to that aggregate 6.2% payroll taxes will benefit most people. It should be obvious that the tax share and discretionary income levels vary at each income demographic.

Besides, as your other post declares-- those taxes are applied to the two institutions the corporate rightwing are trying to demolish: Medicare and Social Security. How many..especially aging Americans are going to get talked into rolling the dice and risking it on the take from a national sales tax after the past three decades of globalization and supply side economics theory?

This other cryptic comment bothers me:"Social Security and Medicare are net reducers of poverty; they're net beneficial to our economy. ." If a program reduces poverty, it's a benefit to the economy! That should be plain and simple and something rightwingers can't deny, since reducing the poverty of the lower classes will give them more spending power and capacity to contribute to circulation of money in the economy...which we are told by many economists of the past few decades is shrinking and leading to market focus on high income earners alone.
"All individuals rather than only employees should more fully contribute to funding those programs" Why? Another doctrinal declaration for no good reason. How many employers are poor? I know they claim to be and will even cite all the deductions their accountants can find to put a lower number on an income statement, but as much as they threaten to go out of business if they have to pay for something...rather than pocketing the money themselves, they stay where they are if they're local, while larger businesses take advantage of the political advantages of the last three decades which allow a company to take bids from competing states offering long tax deferments of many years, free land and even covering the costs of new building, or they just go overseas and take advantage of this wonderful idea of "Free Trade," which has allowed capital to move freely across borders and enrich the investors and owners at everyone else's expense...including the impoverished third world nations where the sweatshops are set up!

And with all that, I haven't arrived at my main objection to using sales taxes to collect revenues: they are the most expensive and inefficient tax collection system! As we learned in Canada when our GST was set up, an army of thousands of bureaucrats have to be employed to set up and monitor the system, while the underground economy grows as service providers and clients often choose a 15% discount over paying the sales taxes!

Sales and excise taxes are the most regressive element in most state and local tax systems. Sales taxes inevi*tably take a larger share of income from low- and middle-income families than from rich families because sales taxes are levied at a flat rate and spending as a share of income falls as income rises. Thus, while a flat-rate general sales tax may appear on its face to be neither progressive nor regressive, that is not its practical impact. Unlike an income tax, which generally applies to most income, the sales tax applies only to spent income and exempts saved income. Since high earners are able to save a much larger share of their incomes than middle-income families — and since the poor can rarely save at all — the tax is inherently regressive.
Sales taxes are usually calculated as a percentage of the price of a fairly broad base of taxable items. Excise taxes, by contrast, are imposed on a small number of goods, typically ones for which demand has a practi*cal per-person maximum (for example, one can only use so much gasoline). Thus, wealthy people don’t keep buying more of these goods as their income increases. Moreover, excise taxes are typically based on volume rather than price — per gallon, per pack and so forth. Thus better-off people pay the same abso*lute tax on an expensive premium beer as low-income families pay on a run-of-the-mill variety. As a result, excise taxes are usually the most regressive kind of tax.

Last edited by right to left; October 17th, 2017 at 10:00 AM.
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Old October 17th, 2017, 11:43 AM   #12
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Excellent ideas.

Every ideologically driven citizen has one law that he would like to see enacted. The trouble is, there is no agreement about which law it should be.

We all have our favorite hobby horse, our recommended silver bullet.

I suggested two laws on Lew Rockwell’s site back in May 2000. It was the first article by me that he posted. Since then, he has posted about 1,700 more. The site no longer numbers them, so I am not sure how many. The article was titled, “Two Teensy-Weensy Legal Reforms.”

Every American visitor to this website probably has a cabinet-level agency that he thinks should be abolished first. I dream such dreams, too. But as I grow older, I become less utopian. So, I’m going to recommend two minor technical revisions of the tax code.
Repeal withholding on all federal income taxes.

Move the date that federal taxes are due to the first Monday of November.

Federal elections are held on the first Tuesday after the first Monday of November.
You can read my arguments here.
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