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Old September 30th, 2016, 02:06 AM   #41
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Jimmyb,

I am sorry, that was an emotional reaction and no good come out that. It was like I had just spent hours painting a picture and walked out of the room, then returned to find yuk thrown all over it. What happened was totally disrespectful of me and everyone else. To blame Daws for the problem here is a failure to understand the problem. You might notice I have been a member here for a long time, but I participate very little. Such bad behavior pulls me down. I need to be with people who do better, so I am lifted up and come closer to being the person I want to be.

I think the person who started this forum had high hopes for what it would become but is mistaken to believe that better forum is possible without strong leadership. And this is how just about everyone today misunderstands democracy and fails to realize his/her responsibility for that democracy. A democracy can not survive without strong leadership, and a democracy is not one person, or a group of elite, doing all the important work for the subjects of their authority. A democracy is as good as all of us working together, or as bad as our failure to do so.

There really needs to be an agreement to stop trashing each other's threads and stop engaging with those who do and then patting each other on the back for chasing away the disliked kid. It is a social activity but it is not what intelligent people come here hoping to find, and it will attract the trolls you don't want.
"but it is not what intelligent people come here hoping to find"

By what standard do you set the bar for intelligence? For me below 100 IQ is less than intelligent. 100 IQ and higher is intelligent.
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Old September 30th, 2016, 08:05 AM   #42
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"but it is not what intelligent people come here hoping to find"

By what standard do you set the bar for intelligence? For me below 100 IQ is less than intelligent. 100 IQ and higher is intelligent.
I set the bar at the reason for coming here. I think we might agree that trolls enter forums for different reasons than people sincerely interested in the purpose of the forum. The purpose of the forum may be to discuss religion, history, politics, science, or share recipes. The intellectual person is looking for information and wanting to share his/her thoughts. The troll is looking for some kind of emotional payoff.

Now sometimes the intellectual can be mistaken as a troll, as I have been many times. I will say taboo things, such as mentioning cannibalism, or God, make a political statement, because I think there is value in thinking about what think. I really don't want an emotional response, but a thinking response. However, the troll can do the same thing to get an emotional response.
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Old September 30th, 2016, 12:36 PM   #43
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About intelligence again. I realized while walking my dog, in the past extremely few people would have intelligence meant the score on an IQ test. It just wasn't part of our thinking, until the 1958 National Defense Education Act introduced IQ testing into the school system!

The purpose for introducing IQ testing into the school system was to help school staff identify the students best suited for higher education. Talk about offensive! If I had my way government test of students would be outlawed. And in case anyone cares, my IQ score was so low, when I was called into the office to discuss my college education, I innocently said I didn't think my IQ was high enough. Laugh I was getting A and B grades at the time. The woman checked my IQ score and dismissed me. I was so offended by the notion of being judged by this one test, I deliberately answered questions wrong. I must have scored around the idiot or moron level, and no one every questioned why someone with such a low IQ score was getting fairly decent grades.

Know those IQ test cover only a limited range of IQ, and they effectively screw a lot of people out of the education they deserve. It is not just that people are wrongly judged, we are all thinking it is normal to judge people by their IQ score instead of their character. In the past character was more important.

Furthermore, education has been narrowed so students test well in this narrow range of intelligence, denying creative people the education they deserve as human beings, and every nation needs creative people for a variety of important reasons.

For over 7 years I lived with a man who can barely read. We are separated now, but we are still good friends. He is a pretty amazing guy much smarter than most people think he is. He learned how to use being stupid to his advantage, but he is not stupid. It is the system that is stupid. When a test depends on the ability to read, all they really test is the ability to read. Intelligence is about a whole more than the ability to read.
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Last edited by Athena; September 30th, 2016 at 02:30 PM.
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Old September 30th, 2016, 01:41 PM   #44
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It's the major example over there, surely? Even decent Americans seem to believe in 'race', though there is no evidence for it. Why?

Right I guess there are no Negros, Polynesians, Orientals, or Caucasians. so Obama isn't the first Negro POTUS. He's just another person who has held that office, and totally fucked the job up.


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Old September 30th, 2016, 02:55 PM   #45
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I am sure the subject of this thread is education. If you want to speak of racism, please connect your comment to education.

I can tell you looking at old textbooks to determine the part of education in racism is revealing. In one about the history of America I saw a tepee and mention of native Americans, and the only pictures of dark skinned people was in a chapter about inventions with the spinning machine and cotton gin being very important inventions, and it being very hard to introduce the cotton industry without the dark skinned people who made that industry so profitable. Others books have pictures of only white folk as though these are the only people on earth.

Disturbing is all the focus on war and preventing war, and the omission of concern for all those living below the poverty and zero concern for the injustices and inequality people who do not look white have faced. Makes me think our efforts to deal with a problem White people have created, are not lacking. I hope modern school books are doing better. I will have to visit schools and check this out.
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Old September 30th, 2016, 03:03 PM   #46
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it is the law that children go to school, so tell me again how no one is being forced?

are you trying to say that all people who have been indoctrinated loose all of their ability for free thought? though that may have been the case w/ you i can guarantee that it is not the same for everyone. also i think that you failed to understand the point of the post, that does not surprise me as you have been completely indoctrinated yourself.
So, what about people who are home schooled or go to private schools?

No, that's what I thought you were saying. I was stating in response what you just said.

Lol I was taught in school to come up with my own beliefs. I was taught the same at home. The only things I was ever "forced" to believe in, in you want to call it that, was the belief in equality. That's pretty much it. I jumped back and forth between ideas for a long time before I came to my current ones. And who knows? Maybe they'll change again. As evidence surfaces, as my experience and knowledges grows, I may gain new perspectives on matters.
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Old September 30th, 2016, 03:07 PM   #47
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"but it is not what intelligent people come here hoping to find"

By what standard do you set the bar for intelligence? For me below 100 IQ is less than intelligent. 100 IQ and higher is intelligent.
Also, we have to remember that it is EQ (emotional intelligence) that more often than not, determines how successful people are, not IQ.
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Old October 9th, 2016, 05:44 AM   #48
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I think the "Fifth Reader" I am quoting from, was copyrighted in 1883 and is on-line
https://archive.org/details/bancroftsfifthre00swetrich

Quote:
Education in the United States

1. For the purpose of public instruction, we hold every man subject to taxation in proportion to his property, and we look not to the question whether he himself have of have not children, to be benefited by the education for which he pays. We regard it as a wise and liberal system of police, by which property and life and peace of society are secured.

2. We hope to excite a feeling of responsibility and a sense of character, by enlarging the capacity and increasing the sphere of intellectual enjoyment. By general instruction, we seek, as far as possible, to purify the whole moral atmosphere; to keep good sentiments uppermost, and to turn the strong current of feeling and opinion, as well as the censures of the law and the denunciation of religion, against immorality and crime. Education, to accomplish the ends of good government, should be universally diffused.

Last edited by Athena; October 9th, 2016 at 05:57 AM.
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Old October 9th, 2016, 06:01 AM   #49
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So, what about people who are home schooled or go to private schools?

No, that's what I thought you were saying. I was stating in response what you just said.

Lol I was taught in school to come up with my own beliefs. I was taught the same at home. The only things I was ever "forced" to believe in, in you want to call it that, was the belief in equality. That's pretty much it. I jumped back and forth between ideas for a long time before I came to my current ones. And who knows? Maybe they'll change again. As evidence surfaces, as my experience and knowledges grows, I may gain new perspectives on matters.


you clearly did not get the cartoon or for some reason it hit a nerve that made you see something in it that wasn't there
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Old October 9th, 2016, 06:15 AM   #50
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you clearly did not get the cartoon or for some reason it hit a nerve that made you see something in it that wasn't there
BS. Everything argument I have with you, you do the same thing: you respond to my argument with a counter, so then I counted as well, but then suddenly, outta nowhere, you say that I didn't understand your post. You did every go damn time! It's getting annoying man.

That's such a stupid cop out. You're such a sore loser.
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