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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:26 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by goober View Post
You're right we're 29th in the OECD
Check it out
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...mortality_rate
It depends what you use, the point is there are a couple of dozen countries at least with lower infant mortality than the US, and what they all have in common is some form of universal health care.
They all pay less, they all have better outcomes.


Actually they did require ship owners to collect money from the wages of seamen, and if the company failed to collect from the wages of seamen, the ship owner was liable for the amount.
Slice it anyway you want, the Federal Government was involved in health care, while the founders were still alive, and one of the founders signed health care legislation, and not one of them said "boo, where's that in the constitution".



When you get to Article 3, get back to me....
Quote:
You're right we're 29th in the OECD
Check it out
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...mortality_rate
It depends what you use, the point is there are a couple of dozen countries at least with lower infant mortality than the US, and what they all have in common is some form of universal health care.
They all pay less, they all have better outcomes.
The U.S. has one of the lowest infant mortality rates in the world.
Quote:
Actually they did require ship owners to collect money from the wages of seamen, and if the company failed to collect from the wages of seamen, the ship owner was liable for the amount.
Slice it anyway you want, the Federal Government was involved in health care, while the founders were still alive, and one of the founders signed health care legislation, and not one of them said "boo, where's that in the constitution".
The Founders did not require ship owners to collect money from the wages of seamen. You have no idea what the Act for the Relief of Sick and Disabled Seamen of 1798 is or means. You have no idea that a seaman was a naval rank. You have no idea that the act was constitutional under Article I, Section 8. You have no idea that the act was also created for national security.

Quote:
When you get to Article 3, get back to me....
Why don’t you break down Article III and its history.
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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:29 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by RNG View Post
Give up. Jimmy knows exactly what the FFs were thinking and that's what counts, not what they wrote and then ratified.

And if you want confirmation, ask him again.
What exactly do you know about the subject? Other than Wikipedia, do you know one single thing about the history of the U.S.?
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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:31 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by goober View Post
It depends what you use, the point is there are a couple of dozen countries at least with lower infant mortality than the US, and what they all have in common is some form of universal health care.
They all pay less, they all have better outcomes.


That is a lie. America counts every live birth, no matter the likely outcome. Most other nations, even EU nations, do not do so. The numbers are thus vastly skewed, vastly skewed.

No country does more to save premature babies either.
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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:33 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by Jimmyb View Post
The U.S. has one of the lowest infant mortality rates in the world.


The Founders did not require ship owners to collect money from the wages of seamen. You have no idea what the Act for the Relief of Sick and Disabled Seamen of 1798 is or means. You have no idea that a seaman was a naval rank. You have no idea that the act was constitutional under Article I, Section 8. You have no idea that the act was also created for national security.



Why don’t you break down Article III and its history.
I see the court has granted your petition for a complete divorce from reality....
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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:38 PM   #85
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I see the court has granted your petition for a complete divorce from reality....
Anytime you want to produce some evidence, feel free to do so.
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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:39 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by Bentley View Post
That is a lie. America counts every live birth, no matter the likely outcome. Most other nations, even EU nations, do not do so. The numbers are thus vastly skewed, vastly skewed.

No country does more to save premature babies either.
No country spends more, I'll give you that, but plenty get the equivalent care for a fraction of the cost.

And do we skew the longevity numbers?
Do other countries count people as living for years after they are buried?
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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:44 PM   #87
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No country spends more, I'll give you that, but plenty get the equivalent care for a fraction of the cost.

And do we skew the longevity numbers?
Do other countries count people as living for years after they are buried?
What country has the same outcomes as the U.S. at a fraction of healthcare spending as a percentage of GDP or better outcomes in general?
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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:47 PM   #88
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Anytime you want to produce some evidence, feel free to do so.
You mean like the text of the law?

Maybe you can point out the part that applies to US Naval personnel...
Quote:
Wth July,
1798.CHAP. [94.] An act for the relief of sick and disabled seamen.
1
§ 1.
Be it enacted, Sfc.
That from and after the first day of September next, the master or ownerof every ship or vessel of the United States, arriving from a foreign port into any port of theUnited States, shall, before such ship or vessel shall be admitted to an entry, render to thecollector a true account of the number of seamen that shall have been employed on board suchvessel since she was last entered at any port in the United States, and shall pay, to the saidcollector, at the rate of twenty cents per month for every seaman so employed ; which sum he ishereby authorized to retain out of the wages of such seamen.§ 2. That from and after the first day of September next, no collector shall grant to any ship orvessel whose enrollment or license for carrying on the coasting trade has expired, a newenrollment or license, before the master of such ship or vessel shall first render a true account tothe collector, of the number of seamen, and the time they have severally been employed on boardsuch ship or vessel, during the continuance of the license which has so expired, and pay to suchcollector twenty cents per month for every month such seamen have been severally employed asaforesaid ; which sum the said master is hereby authorized to retain out of the wages of suchseamen. And if any such master shall render a false account of the number of men, and the lengthof time they have severally been employed, as is herein required, he shall forfeit and pay onehundred dollars.§ 3. That it shall be the duty of the several collectors to make a quarterly return of the sumscollected by them, respectively, by virtue of this act, to the secretary of the treasury ; and thepresident of the United States is hereby authorized, out of the same, to provide for the temporaryrelief and maintenance of sick, or disabled seamen, in the hospitals or other proper institutionsnow established in the several ports of the United States, or in ports where no such institutionsexist, then in such other manner as he shall direct:
Provided,
that the moneys collected in anyone district, shall be expended within the same.
4. That if any surplus shall remain of the moneys to be collected by virtue of this act, afterdefraying the expense of such temporary relief and support, that the same, together with suchprivate donations as may be made for that purpose, (which the president is hereby authorized toreceive,) shall be invested in the stock of the United States, under the direction of the president;and when, in his opinion, a sufficient fund shall be accumulated, he is hereby authorized topurchase or receive cessions or donations of ground or buildings, in the name of the UnitedStates, and to cause buildings, when necessary, to be erected as hospitals for the accommodationof sick and disabled seamen.§ 5. That the president of the United States be, and he is hereby, authorized to nominate andappoint, in such ports of the United States as he may think proper, one or more persons, to becalled directors of the marine hospital of the United States, whose duty it shall be to direct theexpenditure of the fund assigned for their respective ports, according to the third section of thisact; to provide for the accommodation of sick and disabled seamen, under such general instructions as shall be given by the president of the United States for that purpose, and also,subject to the like general instructions, to direct and govern such hospitals, as the president maydirect to be built in the respective ports : and that the said directors shall hold their offices duringthe pleasure of the president, who is authorized to fill up all vacancies that may be occasioned bythe death or removal of any of the persons so to be appointed. And the said directors shall renderan account of the moneys received and expended by them, once in every quarter of a year, to thesecretary of the treasury, or such other person as the president shall direct; but no otherallowance or compensation shall be made to the said directors, except the payment of suchexpenses as they may incur in the actual discharge of the duties required by this act.
[Approved, July
16, 1798.]

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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:51 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by Jimmyb View Post
The US infant mortality rate is not 27th amoung the 27 wealthy countries.

The Founders did not require private companies to pay for medical care.

The Supreme Court is not the Constitution. Anytime you want to provide the clause in the Constitution that supports Obamacare, post it.

If that is the way the Constitution works, then point out that clause also.
Why you are right Jimmy old boy, the SCOTUS is NOT the Constitution.
However, they ARE the court authorized BY that same Constitution to settle and legal argument as to what is or is not Constitutional.
And in the case of the ACA I do believe they have made a ruling. Your opinion is just the opinion of some anonymous guy ranting on the internet, irrelevant, unimportant and insignificant.
Choke.
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Old April 30th, 2017, 01:57 PM   #90
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The US has one of the lowest infant mortality rates in the world.

The US is the only country that uses the full WHO definition of live birth and other countries eliminate several of the criteria. Switzerland uses only two of the four criteria. Italy uses only three of four criteria, etc. This allows other countries to use weight, gestation period, and length to classify a baby as not being born alive, and the US counts all as a live births. Other countries do not count premature births as live births if they die afterwards. The U.S. counts them as live births. The U.S. does more for premature infants than most countries, which also skews the numbers when they do not survive. When factoring in all the criteria, the US has one of the lowest infant mortality rates in the world.

The data regarding Infant mortality rates in the US compared to the rest of the world come from the CDC, and the CDC gets their information from the OECD and the United States Children’s Fund. The data is brutally skewered and misleading.

There is no standard or continuity regarding the registration of babies born too early, too light, and too short in the other countries.

There is no standard or continuity regarding the registration, or preventing selective registration of preterm infants who survived in other countries.

There is no standard or continuity regarding the systematic under-registration of infants who did not survive in other countries.

There is little to no data from the cultures that do not attempt to save prematurely born infants with birth defects. The US always does its best to save any baby born regardless of its condition, and those that do not survive are added to the misleading statistic used by the OECD.

When infants born before 24 weeks are subtracted from the CDC report, the mortality rate decreases by 30%. This accurate data puts the US equal or lower than any other developed country.

Many countries do not consider an infant that dies at birth weighing less than 500 grams as a live birth. The US considers an infant that weighs less than 500 grams and dies at birth a live birth. Eighty percent of these births in other countries do not survive and are not counted, but are counted in the US.

Many countries classify a baby as stillborn or as a miscarriage if it survives less than 24 hours regardless if it is breathing and has a beating heart. The US classifies these infants as live born. Forty percent of all infant deaths happen within twenty-four hours.

If a child in Hong Kong or Japan is born alive but dies within the first 24 hours of birth, he or she is reported as a miscarriage and does not affect the country's reported infant mortality rates.

In Switzerland and other parts of Europe, a baby born who is less than 30 centimeters long is not counted as a live birth. The U.S. counts these infants as live births.



Your list has no basis in history and the Founders set nothing up regarding corporations. Corporations were created and chartered by state legislatures when petitioned. You are using the term “corporations” without any context. There were four types of corporations in the founding era: Corporate charters for religious societies, corporate charters municipalities, corporate charters business corporations, and corporate charters such as the Democratic-Republican Societies.




I have never stated that the Constitution mentions God. I have only stated that most of it has a Biblical basis.

Do you mean like Franklin’s prayer during the Philadelphia Convention asking for God’s help? Or Alexander Hamilton statement “For my own part, I sincerely esteem it the Constitution a system which without the finger of God, never could have been suggested and agreed upon by such a diversity of interests.”

Or James Wilson, who signed both the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, and was one of the most active speakers of the convention having spoken 168 times. He was also a Supreme Court justice from 1789-1798. He was also the first law professor at University of Pennsylvania:
Of law there are different kinds. All, however, may be arranged in two different classes. 1. Divine. 2. Human laws. The descriptive epithets employed denote, that the former have God, the latter, man, for their author.

The laws of God may be divided into the following species.

I. That law, the book of which we are neither able nor worthy to open. Of this law, the author and observer is God. He is a law to himself, as well as to all created things. This law we may name the “law eternal.”

II. That law, which is made for angels and the spirits of the just made perfect. This may be called the “law celestial.” This law, and the glorious state for which it is adapted, we see, at present, but darkly and as through a glass: but hereafter we shall see even as we are seen; and shall know even as we are known. From the wisdom and the goodness of the adorable Author and Preserver of the universe, we are justified in concluding, that the celestial and perfect state is governed, as all other things are, by his established laws. What those laws are, it is not yet given us to know; but on one truth we may rely with sure and certain confidence—those laws are wise and good. For another truth we have infallible authority—those laws are strictly obeyed: “In heaven his will is done.”

III. That law, by which the irrational and inanimate parts of the creation are governed. The great Creator of all things has established general and fixed rules, according to which all the phenomena of the material universe are produced and regulated. These rules are usually denominated laws of nature. The science, which has those laws for its object, is distinguished by the name of natural philosophy. It is sometimes called, the philosophy of body. Of this science, there are numerous branches.

IV. That law, which God has made for man in his present state; that law, which is communicated to us by reason and conscience, the divine monitors within us, and by the sacred oracles, the divine monitors without us. This law has undergone several subdivisions, and has been known by distinct appellations, according to the different ways in which it has been promulgated, and the different objects which it respects.
Etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.


The Constitution says nothing about corporations because that would be a violation of the separation of powers. Why would a compact between the states address slavery? The Constitution does not prohibit the formation of a professional army. There was no need at that juncture for a full time army.
Really now, "a compact between states?"
Then why is Article I section 10 entitled "Powers FORBIDDEN To The States?"
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