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Old January 31st, 2018, 05:29 AM   #1
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Holocaust Denial and Islam

“We consider any denial of the Holocaust or minimizing of its effect a crime [that] distort[s] history and an insult to the dignity of those innocent souls who have perished,” a prominent Saudi cleric stated.

By: The Tower and United with Israel Staff

In a historic move, the leader of the Muslim World League, a group based in Saudi Arabia, has condemned Holocaust denial as a “crime [that] distort[s] history and an insult to the dignity of those innocent souls who have perished.”

In a letter sent to the US Holocaust Memorial Museum last week, Dr. Muhammad bin abdel-Kareem Al-Issa, the secretary general of the Muslim World League, wrote that “history is indeed impartial no matter how hard forgers tried to tamper with or manipulate it.”

Al-Issa wrote the message, sent to museum director Sara Bloomfield, five days before International Holocaust Remembrance Day was marked on January 27.


My note: A prominent Saudi cleric blames Holocaust Deniers. To the contrary, highly politicized Iranian ayatollahs made Holocaust denial the core of their internal and external propaganda. Some Muslim clerics realize, that positioning themselves on the immoral side of the Humankind may undermine Islam. No matter, what did Muhammad. At the bottom line, people do have their own conscience.
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Old January 31st, 2018, 05:37 AM   #2
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“We consider any denial of the Holocaust or minimizing of its effect a crime [that] distort[s] history and an insult to the dignity of those innocent souls who have perished,” a prominent Saudi cleric stated.

By: The Tower and United with Israel Staff

In a historic move, the leader of the Muslim World League, a group based in Saudi Arabia, has condemned Holocaust denial as a “crime [that] distort[s] history and an insult to the dignity of those innocent souls who have perished.”

In a letter sent to the US Holocaust Memorial Museum last week, Dr. Muhammad bin abdel-Kareem Al-Issa, the secretary general of the Muslim World League, wrote that “history is indeed impartial no matter how hard forgers tried to tamper with or manipulate it.”

Al-Issa wrote the message, sent to museum director Sara Bloomfield, five days before International Holocaust Remembrance Day was marked on January 27.


My note: A prominent Saudi cleric blames Holocaust Deniers. To the contrary, highly politicized Iranian ayatollahs made Holocaust denial the core of their internal and external propaganda. Some Muslim clerics realize, that positioning themselves on the immoral side of the Humankind may undermine Islam. No matter, what did Muhammad. At the bottom line, people do have their own conscience.
I suppose many Muslims care little for European history as almost all 'Christians' do for what they did to the Middle East.
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Old January 31st, 2018, 05:46 AM   #3
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Sort of makes the Holocaust a bit suspect of there has to be a law making it illegal to deny or question the validity of the event. I personally feel that the "Holocaust" has been very much overblown from the official version of the story.

I won't tell you what I believe because I don't want to catch hell for being an anti-Semite or a hater. Most of the people who take up the cause of trying to reevaluate what the Holocaust was and wasn't are usually anti-Semites themselves, so they don't really care what others think about them (sort of like the Westboro Baptist Church people who don't give a toot what you think about them, which gives them license to say what they will). But people who are not of the David Duke/Nazi/Identity ilk have to risk their life and reputation to even mention opening the books on the event. Just not allowed.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dRrP7AevKi4

This is an interesting video of the old Phil Donahue Show with a Jewish guy named David Cole (who is stereotypically very annoyingly New York Jewish) who questions the Holocaust and has been to Aushwitz (there is a video of that) where he wears a yamaluke and asks questions to which he found little validity in the answers. Since then, he has been threatened and harassed into silence. Why? If he states that an obvious true event is a lie, he is just branded as a lunatic. No need for threats.

Many Islamic nations including Iran dispute the Holocaust. Iran even several years ago held a conference on the validity of the event, which attracted frankly a lot of kooks, like David Duke and interestingly anti-Isreal Orthodox Jews (the dudes that wear the weird fur hats, curly sideburns etc.)

But it's still weird to threaten people to question history, and the Holocaust has turned into an unquestionable religious event.
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Old January 31st, 2018, 02:36 PM   #4
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Sort of makes the Holocaust a bit suspect of there has to be a law making it illegal to deny or question the validity of the event. I personally feel that the "Holocaust" has been very much overblown from the official version of the story.

I won't tell you what I believe because I don't want to catch hell for being an anti-Semite or a hater. Most of the people who take up the cause of trying to reevaluate what the Holocaust was and wasn't are usually anti-Semites themselves, so they don't really care what others think about them (sort of like the Westboro Baptist Church people who don't give a toot what you think about them, which gives them license to say what they will). But people who are not of the David Duke/Nazi/Identity ilk have to risk their life and reputation to even mention opening the books on the event. Just not allowed.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dRrP7AevKi4

This is an interesting video of the old Phil Donahue Show with a Jewish guy named David Cole (who is stereotypically very annoyingly New York Jewish) who questions the Holocaust and has been to Aushwitz (there is a video of that) where he wears a yamaluke and asks questions to which he found little validity in the answers. Since then, he has been threatened and harassed into silence. Why? If he states that an obvious true event is a lie, he is just branded as a lunatic. No need for threats.

Many Islamic nations including Iran dispute the Holocaust. Iran even several years ago held a conference on the validity of the event, which attracted frankly a lot of kooks, like David Duke and interestingly anti-Isreal Orthodox Jews (the dudes that wear the weird fur hats, curly sideburns etc.)

But it's still weird to threaten people to question history, and the Holocaust has turned into an unquestionable religious event.
My personal experience learns, that ALL people questioning Jewish Holocaust operate out of antisemitic emotions, or out of political or material interest. Many of Holocaust "deniers" (who actually, simply diminish Holocaust) are mentally ill.
For Me the Holocaust isn't question, since it is fact, which decided my life. Both My mother and father are Holocaust survivors. All their pre-war relatives perished. The parents of my late wife survived the concentration camp in Transnistria, but all their relatives perished. And here's a bit of statistics: in the pre-War Stanislavov the Jews constitued 40% of whole population. After the WWII there were 1.000 Jews, mostly newcomers. I suppose, that real number of the Jews perished in the Holocaust exceeds the "sacred" 6.000.000 persons.
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Old February 1st, 2018, 05:09 AM   #5
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My personal experience learns, that ALL people questioning Jewish Holocaust operate out of antisemitic emotions, or out of political or material interest. Many of Holocaust "deniers" (who actually, simply diminish Holocaust) are mentally ill.
For Me the Holocaust isn't question, since it is fact, which decided my life. Both My mother and father are Holocaust survivors. All their pre-war relatives perished. The parents of my late wife survived the concentration camp in Transnistria, but all their relatives perished. And here's a bit of statistics: in the pre-War Stanislavov the Jews constitued 40% of whole population. After the WWII there were 1.000 Jews, mostly newcomers. I suppose, that real number of the Jews perished in the Holocaust exceeds the "sacred" 6.000.000 persons.
In the circumstances of the Liberation the death figures were inevitably all over the place, however, and as a believer in (vigorous) free speech I wish Europe hadn't allowed the zionists to deny it on this issue. I want to set about the Nazi buggers, not support the political descendants of Hitler in imposing silence. It is always used to support Nazism in 'Israel' in my experience, and not for much else. My Dad was allegedly on a Hitler death list, and I'd once planned to settle amongst the Zionists before I learned better, incidentally, so that it's clear where I'm coming from.
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Old February 1st, 2018, 09:33 AM   #6
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The global zionist cabal is trying to erase all of the non-Jewish victims of the Holocaust from history! There were millions of gypsies, slavs, unworthy religious sects like Jehovah's Witnesses, those unworthy because of deformities or behavior-like homosexuals, political unworthies like the vast numbers of German communists who were considered an existential threat to the Nazis....every other group now goes without mention during the annual Holocaust pageant in Jerusalem, while Israeli Zionist killing and warcrimes go unreported and even mentioning them or supporting the BDS movement targeting businesses profiting from operations in Israeli occupied territories is all declared to be Antisemitism under today's doublethink!
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Old February 1st, 2018, 02:37 PM   #7
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The global zionist cabal is trying to erase all of the non-Jewish victims of the Holocaust from history! There were millions of gypsies, slavs, unworthy religious sects like Jehovah's Witnesses, those unworthy because of deformities or behavior-like homosexuals, political unworthies like the vast numbers of German communists who were considered an existential threat to the Nazis....every other group now goes without mention during the annual Holocaust pageant in Jerusalem, while Israeli Zionist killing and warcrimes go unreported and even mentioning them or supporting the BDS movement targeting businesses profiting from operations in Israeli occupied territories is all declared to be Antisemitism under today's doublethink!
Where You heard, that the Jews deny non-Jewish victims of Nazis, of Bolsheviks, of Cambodja Red Khmers, of Biafra, of Rwanda, of Armenia etc.? There's a sort of solidarity between all peoples who suffered Genocide. All these nations turned small and weak just because of genocide. Practically, these nations continue be deprived of their rights because of their small size and weakness, which invites violence. Israel is the first but not the last example.
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Old February 2nd, 2018, 10:05 AM   #8
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Where You heard, that the Jews deny non-Jewish victims of Nazis, of Bolsheviks, of Cambodja Red Khmers, of Biafra, of Rwanda, of Armenia etc.? There's a sort of solidarity between all peoples who suffered Genocide. All these nations turned small and weak just because of genocide. Practically, these nations continue be deprived of their rights because of their small size and weakness, which invites violence. Israel is the first but not the last example.
Sure there is! Did you see any mention of the others..that were usually mentioned in the estimated 10 to 11 million total holocaust casualties last week? I didn't, and I'm getting sick of listening to Israeli leaders playing their holocaust card as a get-out-of-jail-free card to play whenever there is the slightest mention of expulsions of Palestinians, destruction of farmland or building of more settlements and their fenced off roads in the West Bank. The oppressed can and do easily become the oppressors of others when they decide their interests are supreme and the 'others' are not. Some of Israel's leading intellectuals ( I forget the names now) feared that either a slow or a fast ethnic cleansing strategy adopted by Israel would irreparably damage the Israeli psyche. That's why much of the debate between the secularists and the orthodox likudniks like Begin wanted to keep the Sinai NOT the West Bank!

The Sinai was honestly a mostly unoccupied territory rich with resources and underground water supplies, and considered it a far better option for permanent colonization than the occupied West Bank. They didn't really give a flying F about scriptures and idiotic dreams of ethnically cleansing Jerusalem of Arabs and building a third temple to reestablish temple worship. They were pragmatists who felt that Egypt could be dealt with much more easily than forcing more Palestinians off their land to go with the increasinly militant displaced Palestinians that were expelled from Israel proper. They would have offered large cash settlements as a final offer and left the West Bank alone, while developing the Sinai.

That policy might not have been any more ethical than laying claims in Palestinian territory, but it would have reduced Israel's need to exist as a modern day Sparta: a permanent war state with an economy that mostly exists off arms production and field testing(on Palestinians)and shaking down the US Government for increasing amounts of cash.
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Old February 4th, 2018, 12:28 PM   #9
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Sure there is! Did you see any mention of the others..that were usually mentioned in the estimated 10 to 11 million total holocaust casualties last week? I didn't, and I'm getting sick of listening to Israeli leaders playing their holocaust card as a get-out-of-jail-free card to play whenever there is the slightest mention of expulsions of Palestinians, destruction of farmland or building of more settlements and their fenced off roads in the West Bank. The oppressed can and do easily become the oppressors of others when they decide their interests are supreme and the 'others' are not. Some of Israel's leading intellectuals ( I forget the names now) feared that either a slow or a fast ethnic cleansing strategy adopted by Israel would irreparably damage the Israeli psyche. That's why much of the debate between the secularists and the orthodox likudniks like Begin wanted to keep the Sinai NOT the West Bank!

The Sinai was honestly a mostly unoccupied territory rich with resources and underground water supplies, and considered it a far better option for permanent colonization than the occupied West Bank. They didn't really give a flying F about scriptures and idiotic dreams of ethnically cleansing Jerusalem of Arabs and building a third temple to reestablish temple worship. They were pragmatists who felt that Egypt could be dealt with much more easily than forcing more Palestinians off their land to go with the increasinly militant displaced Palestinians that were expelled from Israel proper. They would have offered large cash settlements as a final offer and left the West Bank alone, while developing the Sinai.

That policy might not have been any more ethical than laying claims in Palestinian territory, but it would have reduced Israel's need to exist as a modern day Sparta: a permanent war state with an economy that mostly exists off arms production and field testing(on Palestinians)and shaking down the US Government for increasing amounts of cash.
Begin gave up Sinai, hoping to "buy" Peace in exchange for land. Oslo accords were based on the same hope, however, we have discovered, that we have no territory to give up. In the contrary to Egypt, the Palestinians weren't satisfied even with maximal Israel's concessions. The talks, provided by Olmert's government, which was ready to divide Jerusalem and to perform land swaps, giving Gaza multiple increase of territory, these talks were blown up by the Palestinian side. We learned, that there's no peace with Palestine in exchange for land, which actually ended in the previous concessions.
The problem with the Oslo agreement was that it excluded from the trade most of All Palestine territory, that is Jordan. We argue with Palestine about small piece of land, 30.000 square km, 50% of which is actually Negev desert. Most of Palestine territory, that is Jordan, is not disputed.
The Palestinian narrative about Land, stolen by the Jews, is Big Lie. We cannot make Palestinians be satisfied, since we have no land which may satisfy Palestinian appetite. Therefore, the Palestinians support HAMAS, which demands complete annihilation of Israel and genocide of the Jews.
The Palestinian people know, that they are antisemitic aggressors, that their struggle is immoral. Therefore they relay on the antisemites, from Hitler to British Empire, Nasser, USSR, Europe or Iran. Therefore Palestinian People have developed the industry of antisemitic lies, consumed by antisemitic World.
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Old February 4th, 2018, 12:58 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by senor boogie woogie View Post
Sort of makes the Holocaust a bit suspect of there has to be a law making it illegal to deny or question the validity of the event. I personally feel that the "Holocaust" has been very much overblown from the official version of the story.

I won't tell you what I believe because I don't want to catch hell for being an anti-Semite or a hater. Most of the people who take up the cause of trying to reevaluate what the Holocaust was and wasn't are usually anti-Semites themselves, so they don't really care what others think about them (sort of like the Westboro Baptist Church people who don't give a toot what you think about them, which gives them license to say what they will). But people who are not of the David Duke/Nazi/Identity ilk have to risk their life and reputation to even mention opening the books on the event. Just not allowed.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dRrP7AevKi4

This is an interesting video of the old Phil Donahue Show with a Jewish guy named David Cole (who is stereotypically very annoyingly New York Jewish) who questions the Holocaust and has been to Aushwitz (there is a video of that) where he wears a yamaluke and asks questions to which he found little validity in the answers. Since then, he has been threatened and harassed into silence. Why? If he states that an obvious true event is a lie, he is just branded as a lunatic. No need for threats.

Many Islamic nations including Iran dispute the Holocaust. Iran even several years ago held a conference on the validity of the event, which attracted frankly a lot of kooks, like David Duke and interestingly anti-Isreal Orthodox Jews (the dudes that wear the weird fur hats, curly sideburns etc.)

But it's still weird to threaten people to question history, and the Holocaust has turned into an unquestionable religious event.


Its seems to me that the nazis have became a trump card in the socialist propaganda machine. Look, look at all of the jews that hitler killed (the number grows like the size of the fish your uncle cought each time the story is told) they wave in the air distracting from the tens of millions more that were slaughtered by communist regimes.

The whole thing is sickening IMO
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