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Old April 13th, 2005, 09:08 PM   #1
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Re: True

Socialist countries that have higher taxes have it better all around. Better social programs, shorter work weeks, longer vacations, longer lives, lower pollution, lower crime, etc etc.



It is NOT a crazy idea to suggest higher taxes. IT WORKS.
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Old April 13th, 2005, 09:27 PM   #2
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Re: True

Quote:
Originally Posted by hevusa
Socialist countries that have higher taxes have it better all around. Better social programs, shorter work weeks, longer vacations, longer lives, lower pollution, lower crime, etc etc.



It is NOT a crazy idea to suggest higher taxes. IT WORKS.
Care to tell us which countries you refer to?
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Old April 14th, 2005, 04:48 AM   #3
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Re: True

Quote:
Originally Posted by hevusa
Socialist countries that have higher taxes have it better all around. Better social programs, shorter work weeks, longer vacations, longer lives, lower pollution, lower crime, etc etc.



It is NOT a crazy idea to suggest higher taxes. IT WORKS.


Humm please do tell us which countries you are referring to
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Old April 14th, 2005, 05:59 AM   #4
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Re: True

Quote:
Originally Posted by RWE
[quote name='hevusa']Socialist countries that have higher taxes have it better all around. Better social programs, shorter work weeks, longer vacations, longer lives, lower pollution, lower crime, etc etc.



It is NOT a crazy idea to suggest higher taxes. IT WORKS.


Humm please do tell us which countries you are referring to [/quote]





The socialist Scandinavians of course! They have their priorities in the right places. Unfortunately America's little sister EU is ruining a lot of that beauty. I hope it can still be preserved through this transitional period.
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Old April 14th, 2005, 06:12 AM   #5
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Re: True

Quote:
Originally Posted by hevusa
[quote name='RWE'][quote name='hevusa']Socialist countries that have higher taxes have it better all around. Better social programs, shorter work weeks, longer vacations, longer lives, lower pollution, lower crime, etc etc.



It is NOT a crazy idea to suggest higher taxes. IT WORKS.


Humm please do tell us which countries you are referring to [/quote]





The socialist Scandinavians of course! They have their priorities in the right places. Unfortunately America's little sister EU is ruining a lot of that beauty. I hope it can still be preserved through this transitional period.[/quote]





yeah screw them, here is something which i strongly feel is a problem and it looks as if it is rubbing off here in america "gay marriage was legalized in Scandinavia, marriage itself has virtually ceased to exist." (http://www.wanttoknow.info/visionsofarmageddon)



oh yeah btw about this awsome health care issue..



"As is the case in the other Scandinavian countries, Norway has a National Health Care System. All Norwegians are insured through this system and it is financed through compulsory taxation. Unlike the United Kingdom, the private health care sector is very small, limited to a few clinics, mainly in the Oslo area. These clinics provide supplementary health care. It is, however, not possible for a Norwegian citizen to opt out of the National Health Care System and buy his or her own private health insurance.



During the past few years there have been a number of mass media reports of patients being denied presumed beneficial health care by the system. The system continues to suffer from long waiting lists. Even though the Government has introduced a 'waiting list guarantee' which gives patients with certain conditions a guarantee that they will be treated within 6 months, there has only been a small reduction in the number of patients with these conditions who have waited longer than 6 months for treatment. The issue of health care resource allocation or rationing has thus entered the public debate, as it has in most other countries."





humm seems like we have alot to learn from them
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Old April 14th, 2005, 07:21 AM   #6
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Re: True

Quote:
Originally Posted by RWE
[quote name='hevusa'][quote name='RWE'][quote name='hevusa']Socialist countries that have higher taxes have it better all around. Better social programs, shorter work weeks, longer vacations, longer lives, lower pollution, lower crime, etc etc.



It is NOT a crazy idea to suggest higher taxes. IT WORKS.


Humm please do tell us which countries you are referring to [/quote]





The socialist Scandinavians of course! They have their priorities in the right places. Unfortunately America's little sister EU is ruining a lot of that beauty. I hope it can still be preserved through this transitional period.[/quote]





yeah screw them, here is something which i strongly feel is a problem and it looks as if it is rubbing off here in america "gay marriage was legalized in Scandinavia, marriage itself has virtually ceased to exist." (http://www.wanttoknow.info/visionsofarmageddon)



oh yeah btw about this awsome health care issue..



"As is the case in the other Scandinavian countries, Norway has a National Health Care System. All Norwegians are insured through this system and it is financed through compulsory taxation. Unlike the United Kingdom, the private health care sector is very small, limited to a few clinics, mainly in the Oslo area. These clinics provide supplementary health care. It is, however, not possible for a Norwegian citizen to opt out of the National Health Care System and buy his or her own private health insurance.



During the past few years there have been a number of mass media reports of patients being denied presumed beneficial health care by the system. The system continues to suffer from long waiting lists. Even though the Government has introduced a 'waiting list guarantee' which gives patients with certain conditions a guarantee that they will be treated within 6 months, there has only been a small reduction in the number of patients with these conditions who have waited longer than 6 months for treatment. The issue of health care resource allocation or rationing has thus entered the public debate, as it has in most other countries."





humm seems like we have alot to learn from them [/quote]





Low marriage numbers in Scandinavia has nothing to do with homosexuals whatsoever. It has to do with low church attendance.



And considering Norway has a higher life expectancy than USA, lower crime, lower pollution, better education, shorter work weeks, longer vacations etc. Yes, we do have a lot to learn from socialist countries.



Or do you just enjoy having it worse than you need to?
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Old April 15th, 2005, 08:52 AM   #7
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humm http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...icle633160.ece leader in casual sex.. awesome :thumbsdown: also what a great place to live "Now I don't want to labour the cost of Norwegian travel, but as I alluded to earlier; this place is a seriously expensive country; every time I ordered a beer I was mentally cursing Norway's Oil wealth. A beer costs NOK 55 and you get NOK 11 to the GB£. When I went book shopping a hardback book costs so much I'm surprised the whole nation isn't illiterate."



hum also, pretty much everything is legal there including the new sport for tourists of killing baby seals, yep





New Sport For Tourists:

Killing Baby Seals







Heartless, mindless cruelty by subhuman scum.

A defenseless baby seal is bashed in the skull until dead





It is the ultimate form of extreme holiday 'fun'. Tourists, bored with SAS survival weekends, trekking trips in the Antarctic and booking space flights with Richard Branson, will soon be able to fly to Norway - and shoot baby seals.



The decision to launch the vacations - which have aroused the fury of animal rights groups - follows the recent move by the Norwegian government to expand its annual culling of seals so that amateur enthusiasts can join in.



The aim is to bring about a dramatic increase in the number of deaths of seals, which are blamed by fishermen for devastating drops in the North Sea marine stocks. But the effect has been to outrage conservation groups.



'Killing a baby seal is about the easiest thing you can do if you're inclined to be sadistic; you certainly can't say there's any sport in it - the animal is totally defenceless,' said Paul Watson, founder and president of the radical Sea Shepherd group.



The expansion of Norway's seal cull comes into force in January, following intense lobbying by fishermen, who say the country's large seal population is not only devastating cod and other fish stocks but is infecting other marine life with parasites.



Companies are already offering holidays to both experienced hunters and beginners to take advantage of this relaxation of rules. NorSafari is advertising on the internet for trips that start at 1,400 kroner - about £110 - for a day's hunting and one seal. This rises to 8,200 kroner, or £650, for four days and the guarantee of two seals.



The company's website shows photos of hunters posing with their kill and offers trips that not only include accommodation and food but help with cutting up and preserving seal carcasses. Training is available for beginners, it adds.



Some packages offer a refund to disappointed hunters who don't kill the advertised catch. Extra seals shot will cost another 500 kroner, while another company, Polar Events, advertises: 'We will make sure that your hunt is one not soon forgotten.'



Professional seal hunters have traditionally used clubs to kill seals, but Polar Events' boss, Kjetil Kristoffersen, said tourists would be given rifles to hunt their prey.



'Seals have been hunted in Norway for many years and it's part of the culture,' said Kristoffersen. 'We want people who are interested in hunting, not people who just come to shoot the animal... the tradition up here in Norway [is] we hunt the seal to eat it; it's food.'



Animal rights activists and conservation groups fear that helpless baby seals will become the prime, easy targets of tourists. They also warn that seals are in danger of being over-hunted.



Seal hunting has been a tradition in Norway for thousands of years, but has dwindled recently with only about half the annual 1,200 quota being killed each year. Despite this, under pressure from fishermen the quota was raised to more than 2,000 a couple of years ago.



The decision to include tourists in a practice which, until now has been confined to local experts, is designed to help meet that quota.



Announcing the plan, Norway's Fisheries Minister, Svein Ludvigsen, said the move would 'restore the balance' between fish and seals along Norway's coast and claimed that the hunting of seals was no different from hunting moose. Others liken the practice to hunting foxes, big game or even fish and birds. 'This could be a big hit,' added the minister, whose father was a trawler captain.



This optimism is not shared by many others outside Norway, however, and last week the government appeared to be backing down from its enthusiastic endorsement of seal-hunting holidays on its shores. Ministers worry that the move, even if popular with hunters, will damage the country's image for the majority of tourists.



'This is certainly not an image we are keen to be portrayed with,' said Eirik Bergesen, an information adviser for the Norwegian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, although he stressed that 'for ordinary hunting you can come to Norway and hunt, so what we're doing is actually bringing the rules for seal hunting in accordance with those other hunting laws and guidelines'.









Vacation in the great outdoors! The fresh air! The crimson snow!





The idea of the holidays was also attacked by the International Fund for Animal Welfare. 'Tourists should be encouraged to enjoy and protect wild animals in their natural habitat rather than kill them,' said spokeswoman Gill Sanders.



Some campaigners have disputed the fishermen's claims that there is a link between seals and the decline in fish stocks. 'That's never been scientifically proven,' added Maren Esmark, marine conservation officer for the Norwegian branch of wildlife charity WWF.



Some argue that over-fishing is the cause of devastated fish stocks. Seals, they point out, have happily coexisted with other marine life for most of their history.



'Our position is more seals, more fish,' said Watson. 'The biggest predator of fish like cod is other fish - and seals keep fish like that in check.'



So far, it is unclear how popular the hunts will prove with visitors, however. Polar Events has had no overseas bookings yet. But the website for NorSafari says 'many of the people we have spoken to would like to come to Norway to go seal hunting. Already there is sufficient interest for us to invite hunters to an exciting hunt.' And the Norwegian Hunting and Fishing Association told Jeger (Hunter) magazine there was expected to be interest abroad, especially from Germany.











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Old April 15th, 2005, 07:07 PM   #8
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Alcohol costs a lot in Scandinavia because it is a heavily taxed luxury item (like cigarettes). They work the health care costs right in



And if you compare the way we treat our animals to Scandinavians we are leagues behind. The way animals are treated here, pumped with hormones, anti-biotics, etc...



well, let's just say girls in america achieve maturity at an ever decreasing age because of it.



We don't have half the respect of animals in America as they do there. Having lived in both places it is a VERY obvious thing. They are connected to nature there in a much more respectful way.
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Old April 16th, 2005, 08:55 AM   #9
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yeah i can tell by the bashing of a baby seals head..
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Old April 16th, 2005, 12:49 PM   #10
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yeah i can tell by the bashing of a baby seals head..




Nothing compared to what occurs in chicken coops in America.
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Old April 16th, 2005, 03:46 PM   #11
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Lets just get our definitions correct here shall we.

Norway is a constitutional monarchy,not a socialist country.The only socialist country in the world today (according to experts) is North Korea(some also say Cuba,but others still consider Cuba Communist).



Constitutional Monarchy - a system of government in which a monarch is guided by a constitution whereby his/her rights, duties, and responsibilities are spelled out in written law or by custom.



Socialism - a government in which the means of planning, producing, and distributing goods is controlled by a central government that theoretically seeks a more just and equitable distribution of property and labor; in actuality, most socialist governments have ended up being no more than dictatorships over workers by a ruling elite.
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Old April 16th, 2005, 04:50 PM   #12
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Working time According to the Working Environment Act ordinary working hours shall not exceed 9 hours per day, and 40 hours per week. Shorter hours may have been agreed upon in some enterprises. You may have a right to reduced working hours if material reasons of welfare justify this, and the reduction of working hours does not result in particular inconvenience for the employer. One such reason is the need of parents for more time to spend together with their small children.

Persons engaged in discontinuous shift work or who work on weekends may demand a 36-hour or 38-hour week. By special agreement the working hours during a week may be extended to 48 or 54 hours. You then have the right to a comparable reduction in other weeks, so that the average working hours does not exceed 40, 38 or 36 hours per week. Pay lists shall be kept showing the number of hours overtime worked per week and per calendar year by each employee.



Over time

Work carried out beyond 9 hours per day or 40 hours per week at the same job, is considered overtime. For overtime you shall receive at least 40 percent more than your regular pay. This is true for employees who work during the day. If you work at night or during weekends, there are special rules that apply here. Work exceeding 36 or 38 hours shall then be paid for as overtime.

The employer may not use overtime as a permanent arrangement to get the daily work done. If, because of health problems, or because of special social conditions, you are unable to work overtime, the employer cannot demand that you work any longer than the ordinary working hours. If you need confirmation that you cannot work overtime, a doctor can give you this.

If you work part-time, the rules relating to overtime also apply for the hours with which your hours of work have been reduced. However, you are not entitled to overtime pay for these hours.



Night work

Night work is done between the hours of 21.00 and 06.00.

Usually night work is not permitted, but the Working Environment Act contains a number of exceptions, as for example, for transport, health service, restaurants, hotels. Night work may also be permitted in other cases where it is absolutely necessary.



Weekend and holiday

By holiday is meant the time beginning at 18.00 hours on Saturdays or the day before a public holiday, until 22.00 hours of the day before the next working day. Ordinary work is not to be carried out on Sundays and public holidays. There are, however, many exceptions to this rule. This is true, for example, of transport, health and welfare service, hotel and restaurants. If you work on Sundays and public holidays, you are entitled to time off every second weekend. If you work at an enterprise that is in operation all day, all year round, you are entitled to time off at least every third weekend.



Flexibility

In the public sector and often in the private sector, there is the possibility of flexibility of working time, but you have to be at work during certain "fixed" hours a day. You might for example arrive at 9 am and leave at 5 pm, but also arrive at 8 am and leave at 4 pm.



Rest break

Rest breaks shall be regarded as working time when the employee is not free to leave the workplace during the break.



Incomes and cost of living In Norway average monthly earnings per full-time equivalent were NOK 26 400 for all employees per 3rd quarter 2002. This was an increase of NOK 1 700 or 6.8 per cent from 2001. Average monthly earnings (full-time equivalent) for part-time employees were NOK 22 300 per 3rd quarter 2002. Part-time employees account for about 27 per cent of the total workforce. Average consumerís expenditure per household per year 1999-2001 was 289 459 NOK. This includes goods and services.

In 2002 the number of people in employment reached approximately 2.3 million, or 50 per cent of the population. Women accounted for 47 per cent of the workforce. Many women work part-time, though the numbers are declining. While 47 per cent worked full-time in 1980, the figure had increased to 56 per cent in 2002. The percentage of men in full-time employment remains steady at around 90 per cent and those who work part-time are mainly students.



Women often earn less than men do. In 2001 the average monthly salary for male and female full-time employees was NOK 26 937 and NOK 23 134, respectively. In other words, a womanís salary amounted to 86 per cent of a manís salary. However, this difference varies from one profession to another. In financial services a womanís salary is 76 per cent of a manís salary, while in schools it is almost 95 per cent.

There are only a handful of women in leading positions in Norwegian business and industry, despite the fact that women make up nearly half the work force. Female executives are a rarity. In firms with more than 250 employees there are only 21 women directors as compared with 467 men. Furthermore, these women earn only half of what the men earn and wage growth is much slower than it is for men.



Same # of hours in a work week.Women are paid far less than men.Taxes are high.Cost of living is high.Yeah,Norway is fucking idyllic.
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Old April 30th, 2005, 05:45 PM   #13
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Socialism premotes eqaulity, all you keep expoliting my work so i am down and poor. I say power to the worker.
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Old April 30th, 2005, 07:35 PM   #14
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What exactly is it that you do (or have done) anyways? I'm just wondering. Sorry.
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Old June 27th, 2005, 07:43 PM   #15
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Re: True

Quote:
Originally Posted by RWE
[quote name='hevusa'][quote name='RWE'][quote name='hevusa']Socialist countries that have higher taxes have it better all around. Better social programs, shorter work weeks, longer vacations, longer lives, lower pollution, lower crime, etc etc.



It is NOT a crazy idea to suggest higher taxes. IT WORKS.


Humm please do tell us which countries you are referring to [/quote]





The socialist Scandinavians of course! They have their priorities in the right places. Unfortunately America's little sister EU is ruining a lot of that beauty. I hope it can still be preserved through this transitional period.[/quote]





yeah screw them, here is something which i strongly feel is a problem and it looks as if it is rubbing off here in america "gay marriage was legalized in Scandinavia, marriage itself has virtually ceased to exist." (http://www.wanttoknow.info/visionsofarmageddon)



oh yeah btw about this awsome health care issue..



"As is the case in the other Scandinavian countries, Norway has a National Health Care System. All Norwegians are insured through this system and it is financed through compulsory taxation. Unlike the United Kingdom, the private health care sector is very small, limited to a few clinics, mainly in the Oslo area. These clinics provide supplementary health care. It is, however, not possible for a Norwegian citizen to opt out of the National Health Care System and buy his or her own private health insurance.



During the past few years there have been a number of mass media reports of patients being denied presumed beneficial health care by the system. The system continues to suffer from long waiting lists. Even though the Government has introduced a 'waiting list guarantee' which gives patients with certain conditions a guarantee that they will be treated within 6 months, there has only been a small reduction in the number of patients with these conditions who have waited longer than 6 months for treatment. The issue of health care resource allocation or rationing has thus entered the public debate, as it has in most other countries."





humm seems like we have alot to learn from them [/quote]



I constantly here about the long waiting list. But never here how millions of Americans are on nolist. Millions do not have coverage. Adequate coverage can cost a person 150 to 200 a month. HMO are a joke. Many docs sign on and make money by making it difficult for the patient to get in. Many schedule one HMO per day. Universal health care benifits many. It benefits the people, it benefits business, since they wont have to cough up a lot of money for their employees..



Many say but its our privatized system that makes us the best health care in the world. Well, perhaps we have the best health care in the world, but the majority of the population has no access to it. What good is having the best health care system if 70% of the population can't afford it.



Insurance companies have a very powerful lobby. They select people that are already healthy and most likely not to use the insurance. If you are sick, a diabetic, etc. Your going to have problems getting Insurance, your probably going to pay even higher than the already high price for adequate insurance.



The other problem is that many insurance dictacte what can and can't be done. Not the Doctor.



Another problem is many Americans have little idea what adequate insurance coverage is. Many fall for the believe that they have good isurance at $30 dollars a month. These so call HMO are more of a discount plan than anything else. Your choices are limited as to who can see you. Refferals are very difficult to get, Doctors try to avoid scheduleing these patients. HMO is the biggest joke. You think your $30 a month plan is good, well I hope you dont get seriously ill.



Sorry the biggest joke are discount plans. Recently there are these plans that say we will cover you for $10 a month. It lower than an HMO. They create a fee schedule of what you can have done and they tell you who to go to. An many do not even know it not an isurance plan. They go to the office and ask what does my insurance cover. Then they are told nothing, prices are your resposibility. The "isurance" plan negotiattes a discount.



Our health care system is a mess. SS is nothing to the problems health care is in this country. We are the only industrialize nation with out adequate healthcare. Cuba has a better health care system for their people, and one of the most modern in the world, and every citizen has access to it..
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Old June 28th, 2005, 05:32 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by RWE
humm









Oh my god that is so cruel and heartless. Mean people suck.
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Old July 10th, 2005, 06:53 AM   #17
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Oh my god that is so cruel and heartless. Mean people suck.


That is pretty messed up.



Does anyone REALLY believe socialism is better? Or that it works? And if they do, I want to know where they learned history...
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Old July 10th, 2005, 07:44 AM   #18
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I dont think anyone here can name one socialist country that has it better than the US, if you can name a few features that can be easily compared and that prove that socialist nation to be better than the US.
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Old July 16th, 2005, 07:14 AM   #19
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I dont think anyone here can name one socialist country that has it better than the US, if you can name a few features that can be easily compared and that prove that socialist nation to be better than the US.


Sweden. Lower crime, higher literacy, higher life expectancy, health care for everyone, craddle to grave protection, higher pollution standards, lower pollution, multi-party political system (more than two).



Just came from there... the tap water is great.
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Old July 16th, 2005, 10:56 AM   #20
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oh yeah

Quote:
Originally Posted by hevusa
[quote name='prescott911']I dont think anyone here can name one socialist country that has it better than the US, if you can name a few features that can be easily compared and that prove that socialist nation to be better than the US.


Sweden. Lower crime, higher literacy, higher life expectancy, health care for everyone, craddle to grave protection, higher pollution standards, lower pollution, multi-party political system (more than two).



Just came from there... the tap water is great. [/quote]



Don't forget MUCH higher taxes and a high unemployment rate.
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