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Old November 1st, 2015, 10:26 AM   #61
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People talk about how horrible socialism is, and how millions of people have died under socialist regimes, right? Let's take a look at capitalism. If you calculated the amount of people who have died under the capitalist system (slavery, war, colonization, homelessness, poor working/living conditions, etc), these deaths, which would probably be in the trillions of properly calculated, are not attributed to capitalism by people who support capitalism. However, capitalists and liberals attribute these things to other factors. Why is that?
Because there is a never ending supply of suckers willing to buy another bottle of the snake oil.
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Old November 1st, 2015, 10:30 AM   #62
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a successful capitalist society requires that people behave morally, slavery is not moral, slavery is not consistent with capitalism

Last edited by Gordy; November 1st, 2015 at 10:33 AM.
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Old November 1st, 2015, 10:47 AM   #63
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How in the world can you say that? What drive is there for capitalists to behave morally?

What drives capitalism is profits. I'm not saying that's bad, but it does not have anything to do with morals.
I call it the three-legged bar stool...Price...Quality...and Service....The trick is to balance all three...if not and one leg is out of balance the bar stool falls over, and takes you with it...

In free market capitalism, If you want to maximize profit, It's a forced morality.....Your most profitable customer is a happy customer.....

Price, must be competitive.....Quality must match customer's needs and Service has to be there when the customer needs it.....

example...You can be the cheapest guy in town..but if your workman ship sucks, you fall off the bar stool....Or, Your workmanship is the highest quality there is, but if your price is rediculous, or you show up whenever you feel like it....You fall off your bar stool...Or you can always show up on time but your workmanship sucks or your price is noncompetitive....Yep!!...You fall off your bar stool......That don't mean you're the cheapest, or the best or the fastest.....It means you must balance your product or service to satisfy the most targeted customers....and that is morality...and that will maximize your profits....unless.....

The government (federal, state or local) interferes and sets prices, or passes onerous regulations or imposes quotas on the number of competitors...then the free market model goes out the window and then you have cut-throat, immoral capitalism...
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Old November 1st, 2015, 10:49 AM   #64
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I call it the three-legged bar stool...Price...Quality...and Service....The trick is to balance all three...if not and one leg is out of balance the bar stool falls over, and takes you with it...

In free market capitalism, If you want to maximize profit, It's a forced morality.....Your most profitable customer is a happy customer.....

Price, must be competitive.....Quality must match customer's needs and Service has to be there when the customer needs it.....

example...You can be the cheapest guy in town..but if your workman ship sucks, you fall off the bar stool....Or, Your workmanship is the highest quality there is, but if your price is rediculous, or you show up whenever you feel like it....You fall off your bar stool...Or you can always show up on time but your workmanship sucks or your price is noncompetitive....Yep!!...You fall off your bar stool......That don't mean you're the cheapest, or the best or the fastest.....It means you must balance your product or service to satisfy the most targeted customers....and that is morality...and that will maximize your profits....unless.....

The government (federal, state or local) interferes and sets prices, or passes onerous regulations or imposes quotas on the number of competitors...then the free market model goes out the window and then you have cut-throat, immoral capitalism...
Deprogram yourself. Capitalism doesn't have shit to do with morality. It's all about profit. If MegaCorp decides to pay five year old kids in China $0.25 an hour to work in a sweatshop, they do it out of profit. They may feign morality, but they are really all about profit.
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Old November 1st, 2015, 10:51 AM   #65
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Did we forget about the Boshevic's planned economy, Stalin's planned economies, Hitler's Fascism, Mao's "Great Leap Forward", and Pol Pot communist Khymer Rouge??
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Old November 1st, 2015, 10:53 AM   #66
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Did we forget about the Boshevic's planned economy, Stalin's planned economies, Hitler's Fascism, Mao's "Great Leap Forward", and Pol Pot communist Khymer Rouge??
They'll tell that it simply has never been run correctly, that THEY will do it right.
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Old November 1st, 2015, 11:00 AM   #67
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Deprogram yourself. Capitalism doesn't have shit to do with morality. It's all about profit. If MegaCorp decides to pay five year old kids in China $0.25 an hour to work in a sweatshop, they do it out of profit. They may feign morality, but they are really all about profit.
And why is that??....Because a government is allowing it to happen...MegaCrp is merely taking advantage of a government's negligence in providing reasonable rules....If MegaCorp is all moral about it and don't do it, MaxiCorp will....
.
It's the demand of the consumer who enables the immorality to continue....If the consumer thinks it is immoral, then don't buy products manufactured in China......

And 35 years of running (and building from penny one) business' has programmed me the hard way...so don't hold your breath on the deprogramming
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Old November 1st, 2015, 11:06 AM   #68
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And why is that??....Because a government is allowing it to happen...MegaCrp is merely taking advantage of a government's negligence in providing reasonable rules....If MegaCorp is all moral about it and don't do it, MaxiCorp will....
But haven't you been making the argument that government regulation is harmful to corporations?

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It's the demand of the consumer who enables the immorality to continue....If the consumer thinks it is immoral, then don't buy products manufactured in China......
True, but it is also in the nature of corporations to do things that not only cut costs, but maximize profit. In addition, globalization is real. You'd be hard-pressed to find products that aren't made under such conditions.
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Old November 1st, 2015, 11:11 AM   #69
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I call it the three-legged bar stool...Price...Quality...and Service....The trick is to balance all three...if not and one leg is out of balance the bar stool falls over, and takes you with it...

In free market capitalism, If you want to maximize profit, It's a forced morality.....Your most profitable customer is a happy customer.....

Price, must be competitive.....Quality must match customer's needs and Service has to be there when the customer needs it.....

example...You can be the cheapest guy in town..but if your workman ship sucks, you fall off the bar stool....Or, Your workmanship is the highest quality there is, but if your price is rediculous, or you show up whenever you feel like it....You fall off your bar stool...Or you can always show up on time but your workmanship sucks or your price is noncompetitive....Yep!!...You fall off your bar stool......That don't mean you're the cheapest, or the best or the fastest.....It means you must balance your product or service to satisfy the most targeted customers....and that is morality...and that will maximize your profits....unless.....

The government (federal, state or local) interferes and sets prices, or passes onerous regulations or imposes quotas on the number of competitors...then the free market model goes out the window and then you have cut-throat, immoral capitalism...
You just made my point. It is forced morality, or as I prefer to phrase it, enlightened self-interest. And not doing good for it's own sake.

And even then one must assume that there is a regulatory framework to prevent out and out dishonesty.
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Old November 1st, 2015, 11:22 AM   #70
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But haven't you been making the argument that government regulation is harmful to corporations?.
The key word in there is reasonable...allowing or making 5 year-olds to work 16 hours a day 7 days a week, is not reasonable.....just like expecting your own economy to compete with $15 per hr minimum wages on a global economy, is not reasonable....In today's world economy the cost of labor will always be trying to balance itself....
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