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Old February 12th, 2018, 04:12 PM   #1
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IQ: Ranges, Meaning, and Achievement

IQ: Ranges, Meaning, and Achievement

This Thread is intended to present material on IQ research that will be explored by all members that wish to participate. Arguments both for and against (as well as neutral) are all welcome. If members have further research/findings they would like to present, by all means, please do so--any & all contributions are encouraged.


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Consider, a normal IQ score falls between the range 85-115 which is approximately 70% of the population (and only 15% of people have an IQ of 115 or above), while an extended average IQ range tends to encompass those between 80-119 which is "x"% of the population. In order to qualify for the International High IQ Society, one must have an IQ of 125 or above, while entry into Mensa (a High IQ organization that represents the upper 2% of the population) requires an IQ of 2 standard deviations above average (or 130 and above). For the lower end of the bell curve, this will be explored later on in the post (as well as a more proper breakdown of the rest of the distribution).

Now, what do these numbers mean? That is, in principle, what can one do with a 100 IQ? It turns out, many studies have been done linking average IQ scores to completion of College Majors, SAT scores, and GRE (set aside the problematic elements for a moment, of which we can explore later). As for College Majors, studies have revealed a strong correlation for between those who go far into/complete specific college majors and IQ. The breakdown is as follows:

Top End of Spectrum

-Physics & Astronomy (133)
-Mathematical Sciences (130)
-Philosophy (129)
-Materials Engineering (129)
-Economics (128 )
-Chemical Engineering (128 )
-Other Engineering (128 )
-Mechanical Engineering (126)

Bottom End of Spectrum

-Administration (107)
-Home Economics (106)
-Special (106)
-Student Counseling (105)
-Early Childhood (104)
-Social Work (103)

In order to attend College and be successful, it was found that an IQ of 110-115 is standardly required. Now, if a person with a 110-115 IQ attempted to be a Physics & Astronomy major, it has been found that they would quickly run into trouble and likely have to drop out (or fail out) early on. However, they would be successful at other college majors, some of which were listed previously. Then, an individual with a 100 base IQ has been shown to not (currently) be able to attend college successfully.

To put this in practical terms, lets take the example of those with an IQ 2 standard deviations from the norm in the *adult population* (2% of the population), or Physics & Astronomy combined with Mathematical Sciences Majors (closely followed by Philosophy and certain Engineering Majors, but we will limit our discussion to those past the threshold). This indicates that if we took a random sampling of 100 adults, approximately 2 would have a mind currently capable of the "brain power" necessary to do Complex Analysis or Statistical Mechanics (which is in-line with Senior level Physics or Math major cognitive abilities). As for what a 115 IQ would look like in practical terms, such a person would (currently) struggle tremendously to get a Political Science degree if they were able to attain it at all (IQ 120), while they would be able to get a degree in Business (114), Education (110), ect. See list here for more details: [https://thetab.com/us/2017/04/10/whi...ghest-iq-64811)

Now, IQ links to Standardized Tests such as the SAT and GRE are quite interesting as well--let us proceed with investigating the case of SAT scores. We will use the 1600 score standard (Note: a link to conversions between 2400 to 1600 score standards will be provided under *Sources* if one were curious). Consider, a score of 925 on the SAT (is claimed) to translate to a base 100 IQ. Here is an outline mapping out key points on the Bell Curve:

IQ, SAT, Meaning

- 55, 400, Trainable Moderate Mental Retardation
- 66, 525, Mild Mental Retardation
- 75, 630, Borderline Mental Retardation
- 87, 775, Dull
- 100, 935, Average
- 113, 1100, Bright
- 120, 1200, Very Bright
- 130, 1310, Extremely Bright
- 141, 1445, Briliant
- 151, 1575, Very Brilliant

For convenience, a few figures converted to the 2400 point scale (conversion chart here- [https://blog.prepscholar.com/new-sat...00-to-new-1600) ):

IQ, SAT

- 75, 820
- 87, 1020
- 100, 1260
- 113, 1510
- 120, 1670
- 130, 1840
- 141, 2070
- 151, 2340

[Note: There are various IQ scales, some reach to numbers higher well higher to this, this is a Standard Scale, others could be used with similar (though varying in extent) results]
Follow this link to find an IQ Reference Table which outlines IQ ranges and typical corresponding abilities:

[https://www.easycalculation.com/medi...core-table.php)
Below is a transcription of the outline (IQ range, Category, Typical Ability):

1. 0-24
Profound Mental Retardation
Limited or no ability to communicate, eat, bath, dress and toilet.

2. 25-39
Severe Mental Retardation
Limited ability to communicate, eat, bath, dress and toilet. No academic skills.

3. 40-54
Moderate Mental Retardation
Some independent self-help skills and very basic academic skills.

4. 55-69
Mild Mental Retardation
Usually able to dress/bath independently and can do simple jobs. Elementary school academics.

5. 70-79
Border Line
May live independently with difficulties. Can perform simple and repetitive jobs.

6. 80-89
Low Average
Can complete vocational education and live independently.

7. 90-109
Average
Can complete high school graduation and college with difficulty.

8. 110-119
High Average
Typical level of college graduates.

9. 120-129
Superior
Typical level of persons with doctoral degrees.


10. 130-144
Gifted
Capable of understanding highly, complex academic material.

11. 145-159
Genius
Exception intellectual ability and capable of looking beyond known facts.

12. 160-175
Extraordinary genius
Extraordinary talent like Albert Einstein

Sources

1. www.iqcomparisonsite.com/oldSATIQ.aspx
2. https://www.statisticbrain.com/iq-es...college-major/
3. What Is An IQ Test? What Is A High IQ Score?
4. https://www.123test.com/interpretation-of-an-iq-score/
5. https://pumpkinperson.com/2015/12/16...q-equivalents/
6. https://steemit.com/education/@chhay...is-is-the-case
7. https://thetab.com/us/2017/04/10/whi...ghest-iq-64811
8. https://blog.prepscholar.com/new-sat...00-to-new-1600
9. https://www.easycalculation.com/medi...core-table.php
10. https://www.easycalculation.com/medical/ iq-score-table.php
11. Academic achievement, income, IQ
12. Average IQ of students by college major and gender ratio | Dr. Randal S. Olson
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Old February 13th, 2018, 02:42 AM   #2
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Do you know your IQ?

I've had mine tested several times with the results ranging from a low of 150 to a high of 165.

I disagree with the claim that IQ tests and the concept of IQ in general are not useful. How about you?

Without doubt not every IQ test will produce meaningful results when applied to people regardless of impediments such as a cultural mismatch. Nevertheless, well-designed IQ tests do measure a person's ability to process new knowledge, the speed at which they process new knowledge, and their ability to recognize patterns and the speed at which patterns are recognized.

I think tests so constructed indeed do provide meaningful results.
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Old February 13th, 2018, 04:01 AM   #3
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A young brunette goes into the doctor's office and says that her body hurts wherever she touches it.
"Impossible," says the doctor. "Show me."

She takes her finger and pushes her elbow and screams in agony. She pushes her knee and screams, pushes her ankle and screams and so it goes on, everywhere she touches makes her scream.

The doctor says, "You're not really a brunette, are you?"

She says, "No, I'm really a blonde."

"I thought so," he says. "Your finger is broken."
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Old February 13th, 2018, 04:06 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clara007 View Post
A young brunette goes into the doctor's office and says that her body hurts wherever she touches it.
"Impossible," says the doctor. "Show me."

She takes her finger and pushes her elbow and screams in agony. She pushes her knee and screams, pushes her ankle and screams and so it goes on, everywhere she touches makes her scream.

The doctor says, "You're not really a brunette, are you?"

She says, "No, I'm really a blonde."

"I thought so," he says. "Your finger is broken."
5. 70-79
Border Line
May live independently with difficulties. Can perform simple and repetitive jobs.

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Old March 1st, 2018, 09:17 PM   #5
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I could mention Jayne Mansfield, but...

"There must have been occasional moments of thoughtfulness, and at times the public role must have seemed stupid and frustrating. She was said to have a genius I.Q. – over 160 – and that, at least, was not merely a press agent's claim. But she kept her intelligence well hidden." - Source

However, she was a natural-born brunette.
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Old March 2nd, 2018, 07:43 AM   #6
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IQ is over-rated. I say that as a person whose IQ consistently tests out at 136-138.

A person's apparent intelligence is affected by other factors, like emotional issues. Unresolved emotional problems cause a person to say and do things in compensation for them that make the person seem very stupid. A person with a high IQ can have a bad memory and that has an effect. Or s/he can suffer ADHD or ADD which can also interfere.

IQ is just one piece of a puzzle.
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Old April 3rd, 2018, 10:16 PM   #7
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In your list, you seem to have left out the lucky number category:

13. 176-200
Fucked
If you are lucky enough to live in a tolerant culture like the Enlightenment, then you will be accepted as an eccentric and allowed to be productive. In an intolerant culture like modern degenerate liberal culture, you will be seen as a freak and rejected and live as an outcast.
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Old April 3rd, 2018, 10:53 PM   #8
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Quote:

Vijay Jojo Chokal-Ingam, older brother of actress Mindy Kaling, committed racial fraud to get into medical school. Yet he did not admit his crimes until after the statute of limitations had long expired. Now Chokal-Ingam is going full frontal with his book Almost Black: The True Story of How I Got into Medical School by Pretending to Be Black.

17 years ago, Chokal-Ingam was a slacker and party animal who barely scraped by in college with a pitifully low 3.1 GPA. Yet like any Indian kid, becoming a doctor was his do-or-die dream. In between fun and games, Chokal-Ingam somehow reached the conclusion that affirmative action was his golden ticket to getting into medical school.

In Almost Black, Chokal-Ingam tells the story of how he scammed his way into medical school by exploiting affirmative action. He shaved his head, trimmed his long Indian eyelashes, embraced his black-sounding middle name Jojo, joined the Organization of Black Students, and checked the box marked “BLACK” on his med school applications. To his immense gratification, Chokal-Ingam hoodwinked 11 American medical schools into interviewing him and miraculously got waitlisted at the country’s third and fourth best medical schools.

The Book - Almost Black
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Old April 3rd, 2018, 11:05 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franklin View Post
In your list, you seem to have left out the lucky number category:

13. 176-200
Fucked
If you are lucky enough to live in a tolerant culture like the Enlightenment, then you will be accepted as an eccentric and allowed to be productive. In an intolerant culture like modern degenerate liberal culture, you will be seen as a freak and rejected and live as an outcast.
@Franklin

That is correct. For instance, although an IQ of 700 would provide excellent computational power, pattern recognition, and some other cognitive skills, one would be so far away from the rest of Humanity as to lead a life as a ‘social leper’; rejected, excluded, isolated, and lonely. In short, it would be a miserable life, as humans require social contact to maintain mental health & stability in a similar way they require food, water, ect. for physical health & stability. An IQ of such a high level would prove to be a curse, superficially packaged as a gift.
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Old April 3rd, 2018, 11:51 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by imaginethat View Post
Do you know your IQ?

I've had mine tested several times with the results ranging from a low of 150 to a high of 165.

I disagree with the claim that IQ tests and the concept of IQ in general are not useful. How about you?

Without doubt not every IQ test will produce meaningful results when applied to people regardless of impediments such as a cultural mismatch. Nevertheless, well-designed IQ tests do measure a person's ability to process new knowledge, the speed at which they process new knowledge, and their ability to recognize patterns and the speed at which patterns are recognized.

I think tests so constructed indeed do provide meaningful results.
@imaginethat

My apologies, I did not see this when you first posted it.

Yes, I think IQ has some reasonable success with ball-parking particular aspects of cognitive abilities--typically those that align well with how our academic system is structured and the traditional job market; which is why I believe it tends to be a reasonable predictor in those areas. However, IQ is still a starting attempt to capture a very complex topic, and only has partial success. I have discussed some of this a bit more in a recent Thread by Athena, which I can copy and past here. Also, below, I provide a few critiques/criticisms of IQ testing--as well as how it relates to 'general intelligence'.

A) IQ tests are right to time tests in certain areas, as computational speed is pertinent to intelligence. However, this is also highly limited that there is not a section that accounts for deep critical thought that occurs over very long time periods, such as the intelligence required to read a book the likes of "Gulliver's Travels" by Jonathon Swift and follow what is going on to the depth that the author intended. Or, better yet, to independently create such a story. Consider, this is truly one of the most important types of human intellect, which helps distinguish us from "calculators" (which, although very fast & powerful, are quite constrained in ability to the "rules"). A true intelligence test should be taking this into account, separate to the portions of the test that are timed

(B ) Many of the questions themselves are fundamentally flawed. Psychologists are attempting to design an all encompassing intelligence test while failing to realize that they necessarily aren't the most intelligent--thus would fail at the task in ways they (very likely) are unable to foresee (or possibly even understand). Consider, some of the question are typically along the line, "Identify the pattern, determine what comes next". Now, it is quite possible that there is more than one pattern that may occur to a person of high intellect, thus delaying their computational speed score and (possibly) arriving at the "wrong" conclusion--even though the pattern identified is entirely self-consistent.

(C) Background knowledge is necessary in order to take the test, thus those unfamiliar with, for instance, particular terms or membership to a group, will necessarily do poorly on such a question, regardless of their ability to identify the relationship (or not).

(D) There are far superior ways to test for computational speed and power, although it would necessarily require education (which they are attempting to factor out of the equation). Now, an issue with not introducing this factor is that it can truly skew the results. That is, it is patently obvious that a human mind capable of doing some extremely involved triple integral in their head within a certain time constraint (i.e. while timed) is a much better indicator of their brain's computational speed & power then essentially the riddles that are often employed in IQ tests. Now, it is absurd to claim that if person (A) can do the triple integral problem but gets "tripped up" on the IQ riddle problem, while person (B ) cannot not even dream of doing the triple integral prb. while flies through the IQ riddle--then, person (B ) is therefore more Quantitatively intelligent/advanced (although this is the current system). Note: This is not just a hypothetical, it has famously been reported that Richard Feynman scored an IQ of 125 while a typical Physics Major is (claimed) to be IQ 133. This is an absurdity, and demonstrates a clear issue with the testing, not that Feynman somehow managed to win a Nobel in Physics for his work in QED, contribute to the Manhattan Project, ect. with an intelligence level less than a typical Physics Undergraduate--as many people actually seem to believe simply because of the authority surrounding IQ tests

Do note, again, I think IQ has notable success in particular areas, as it is designed--though I do take issue with the term 'general intelligence' applied in correlation to the test (typically referred to as the 'g factor'); as, I think this is only part of the story.

You asked about my IQ; I have never had it formally tested. If Psychologists translations to academic performance are to be believed, then my IQ would be in the low 130 range (+ or - a few points, presumably). I have taken the corresponding test for the High IQ society, and scored in the low 130's--though it is typically not considered nearly as rigorous/formal as others (though it credentials one for membership, if desired). I recently discovered that Mensa administers exams every so often at a testing center 30-40 minutes from my place, for about $40. I will likely take it at some point in the relatively near future, as it would be interesting to quantify and self-discover.

Actually, I find this subject very interesting for a number of reasons. For instance, one reason--due to my academic field of study, I know a lot of people who would score well on IQ tests (which certainly does match with some of their abilities), but have noticed there is very little correlation with the other key aspect of intelligence I discussed previously, which is the deep type of critical thinking that happens over long periods of time (which IQ tests necessarily do not test), as well as new pattern recognition, and such, as opposed to pre-determined patterns (this is one of the reasons why people on the extreme edge of high IQ can actually score significantly lower than would be expected, like Feynman, for instance). Further, I know people that would likely do not so well on IQ tests that are better critical thinkers than many I know with high IQ (though, the lower IQ person certainly is not going to become an engineer, for instance, as the higher IQ person might). Actually, a good example of this sort of 'moderately low IQ Smart' person would be George Carlin, and some other comedians, for that matter.

Another marker to put this all in perspective: The low-ball estimates for Chimpanzee IQ is 20ish, while it is often put standardly around 40-50 range. That is, a rather intelligent Chimp has many cognitive capacities essentially on par/indistinguishable from a person who has moderate to severe mental disabilities. We truly are just ever so slightly above our closest relatives.

Finally, in regards to your high IQ score; have you noticed an ability to pick up on certain tasks rather quickly, much more so than peers? Or, high aptitude toward learning, when applied, generally? I would be interested hear your experience, in this respect. Also, have you ever joined Mensa, or some other High IQ society? For Mensa, the minimum score is 130 (or, 2 standard deviations), so your score would be well past the mark. Actually, I believe there is another High IQ society for those at 3 standard deviations or above.

Last edited by xMathFanx; April 4th, 2018 at 12:38 AM.
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