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Old February 15th, 2018, 08:23 AM   #21
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As I already said, I touch people. How are to know who is okay being touched and who is not?
Intuition.

I'm serious.
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Old February 15th, 2018, 08:44 AM   #22
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Some people simply do not like being touched by strangers. Or by certain people they know for that matter. I agree that a hug can be good for you. It can be comforting. It can make you feel better. When it is wanted. When it isn't, it's a totally different experience.

I think that what is going on in our culture is that sexual abuse has become a more open topic. We no longer refer to pedophiles as 'funny uncles' and simply keep kids away from them without telling them why any more and rape victims are no longer.....for the most part....treated as if they must have done something to deserve it.

I spent a few years working with mentally challenged adults myself. We also had a 'no touch' policy. It was more for our sake than the clients. Mentally challenges adults are like children. It's not difficult to get them to say whatever you want. Remember the McMartin Preschool case?
No, I don't remember McMartin but have a vague memory of children being lead to answer questions that lead to a charge of abuse. Is that what you are referring too? I can see where that could be a serious problem. And the increased talk of abuse.

Yes! I had my crazy uncle type experiences as a child but surely did not see the bigger picture. So as an adult when I learned of pedophiles, I was confused and could not understand why anyone would have a sexual reaction to a child. That is a serious problem. And I think it comes up in Walt Disney movies? There is a part in Fantasia that is questionable. Youtube has many examples of Disney movie scenes that may not be appropriate.

I am amazed by what I am seeing that I didn't see before, so I think your explanation of change is a good one. I was not offended by the TV shows I mentioned until the discussion came up in the thread of women lying. I am seeing things differently but I don't want to go far over the line of intolerance and tyranny. On pedophiles, I have a firm line! But adults and what happens in the office? Isn't public shame and loosing a career a bit extreme?
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Old February 15th, 2018, 09:07 AM   #23
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Intuition.

I'm serious.
I am not sure that works so well, but you raised my awareness of a problem. I stopped hugging old men and agreeing to a kiss, when I learned the hug and kiss meant something very different to them, than what I was expecting! I was not expecting that from old men.

I am still dealing with a lot of confusion. There are those wonderful moments of affection and then the dragon raises its head and we realize there is another dimension to this moment. I am not going to bash the man for this, but I will keep my distance in the future. In a way I think this is really sad because the man can be lonely and there could be pleasure in the relationship if only that dragon didn't raise its head. Whatever, my instincts tend to get me into trouble. I am thinking affection and those around me are thinking sex.
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Old February 15th, 2018, 10:23 AM   #24
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Intuition.

I'm serious.


Teachers have to deal with this "touchy" thing all the time. There are appropriate places to touch--a shoulder, an arm, top of the head (for children).

I'm a HUGGER from way back--so when a student hugs (hugged) me--I hugged them back. Shaking hands--great. Parents--same deal.
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Old February 15th, 2018, 10:44 AM   #25
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As a male teacher, I didn't TOUCH a student ANYWHERE - shoulder, hand, top of head - ANYWHERE - for the last ten years of my tenure.

I'm not naturally a real huggy, affectionate sort, so I never really touched them often anyway. But sometimes you'd touch a person's shoulder, or their hand when talking to them. Or even kind mock slugging them on the arm when joking.

But not now. You don't go within two feet of a student.

Remember back in the days when everybody used to pat little kids' butts?! CAN YOU IMAGINE TODAY?????
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Old February 15th, 2018, 10:51 AM   #26
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Now that is a good statement. Yes, we are all in competition with each other, just like peacocks strutting their feathers. And I think it is stupid as hell for a female to make herself as attractive to the male as she can, and then object to his natural response. It helps to wear clothes that say "no" and to conduct one's self in a business manner.

One more thing, being treated like a lady is very appreciated. That is respectful and makes a woman feel valued.
There is some validity in your stance in this thread. And my feeling too is that this pendulum has swung a bit too far to the everything is harassment" side.

BUT anecdotally, from my many years of experience with alpha males and rich assholes, they won't ever believe that no means no.

And if a few guys have to be crucified to get the message across, it's their own fault.

This type of overreaction is unfortunately necessary to get people, mostly men into the 20th century, let alone the 21st.
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Old February 15th, 2018, 11:34 AM   #27
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So you were still in grade school??
I skipped a few grades so im not sure.
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Old February 15th, 2018, 12:33 PM   #28
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I am not sure that works so well, but you raised my awareness of a problem. I stopped hugging old men and agreeing to a kiss, when I learned the hug and kiss meant something very different to them, than what I was expecting! I was not expecting that from old men.

I am still dealing with a lot of confusion. There are those wonderful moments of affection and then the dragon raises its head and we realize there is another dimension to this moment. I am not going to bash the man for this, but I will keep my distance in the future. In a way I think this is really sad because the man can be lonely and there could be pleasure in the relationship if only that dragon didn't raise its head. Whatever, my instincts tend to get me into trouble. I am thinking affection and those around me are thinking sex.
That part about old men, is humorous, I've had the same experience with Older women; I moved into a townhouse back in Dec. of 91, and I was the youngest male in the Complex. I used to hug some of the women once in a while like when they would bring me some home baked treats, over the holidays, garden parties, pick nicks, etc. Then I noticed that some of them started to act more than just neighborly, like crushing their breasts into my chest and not letting go right away. So I just stopped any physical contact with them, and that's too bad because I'm a natural born hugger. Anyway now that I'm an "Old Man", I appreciate a hug now and then from a pretty young lady, and it has nothing to do with sex. I don't consider my self as old, because I certainly don't feel, or think "old", and folks are always telling me that they can't believe I'm the same age as Mink Jager.
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Old February 15th, 2018, 01:41 PM   #29
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Isn't public shame and loosing a career a bit extreme?
To my way of thinking.....no.

We're talking about grown men. Not little boys who don't know any better.

Grown men who damn well know better but use their power to take advantage of those who have no power.
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Old February 15th, 2018, 01:45 PM   #30
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That part about old men, is humorous, I've had the same experience with Older women; I moved into a townhouse back in Dec. of 91, and I was the youngest male in the Complex. I used to hug some of the women once in a while like when they would bring me some home baked treats, over the holidays, garden parties, pick nicks, etc. Then I noticed that some of them started to act more than just neighborly, like crushing their breasts into my chest and not letting go right away. So I just stopped any physical contact with them, and that's too bad because I'm a natural born hugger. Anyway now that I'm an "Old Man", I appreciate a hug now and then from a pretty young lady, and it has nothing to do with sex. I don't consider my self as old, because I certainly don't feel, or think "old", and folks are always telling me that they can't believe I'm the same age as Mink Jager.
I didn't used to worry about hugs from old men. Then they invented Viagra.
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