Political Forums  

Go Back   Defending The Truth Political Forum > Political Issues > Social Issues

Social Issues Social Issues and Problems - Social issues, social ill, social problems


Thanks Tree64Thanks
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old June 7th, 2018, 10:16 AM   #71
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,745
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNVolunteer73 View Post
How did they get a head, the would receive charity for a while. Then they were expected to make it on their own.
Life has always been a little more complicated than your explanation and for sure the requirements today, and therefore the barriers, are much more challenging than they once were.

How did the colonist get land and what did they do with it to make a profit? Why was it believed owning land is essential liberty? What did slaves and the laboring immigrants have in common? How have things changed since the colonial days? What did Calvinism have to do with economic development and capitalism?

Later when the people moved west, how did they get land and what did they do with it?

It seems to me a simple fact you are missing is they got the resources for making a profit for free or nearly free. Indentured servants could buy their plantation when their period of being indentured was over. Pioneers got land simply by claiming it and working it. Equal opportunity meant the bounty of nature was there for anyone to take, and the first to get there, were the ones who got to make the claims on nature's bounty. This is no longer our reality.

What was required was only a willingness to work. That is no longer true. However, there also had to be connections with the old world and forms of transportation. But, no one needed a college education, and the skills, even specialized skills people learned, were so simple someone with the IQ of a moron could learn them. Much of the learning was done through apprenticeship, and this included room and board and some pay during the learning period. The father was responsible for his son's apprenticeship. Mothers trained their daughters in domestic skills and until industrialization, they were dependent on men. Even after industrialization women were dependent on men because the wages were so low and immigrants were exploited by the industrial owners and the landlords who owned housing. Because few had formal education, most were trapped in poverty.
Thanks from right to left

Last edited by Athena; June 7th, 2018 at 10:20 AM.
Athena is online now  
Old June 7th, 2018, 10:42 AM   #72
I'm debt free
 
TNVolunteer73's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Lebanon, TN
Posts: 36,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by tristanrobin View Post
You are equating the basic humiliations and emotional shattering that is racism and bigotry with getting teased because you have red hair?

My god you're a superficial, shallow, callous, ignorant, self-involved, white-privilege-enjoying cretin.
Being teased because you have red hair is no less racist/Bigoted than being teased because you are black or white or yellow or red.
TNVolunteer73 is offline  
Old June 7th, 2018, 10:45 AM   #73
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,745
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Sister View Post
Ben Franklin was tall and bumped his head on the new barn he built. The Contractor said lower your head and Ole Ben said, make the barn taller.

edit: paraphrase
Did Ben build the barn or did he hire someone to build the barn?

This is a good bone to pick in a thread about being fair. In fact, now that I think about it, if my family were rich, my great grandson's identify problem would be very different. Money makes a huge difference in how we feel about ourselves and our position in the pecking order and how safe or threatened we feel.

Ben got his money by marrying a wealthy woman and then he abandoned her and played around in France until she died and he had to return to run his business himself. We might have never heard of Ben Franklin if he had not married a wealthy woman. His father was a candlestick maker who could not afford his children's education, so he invited important men in the city to dinner, and his children learned of life around the dinner table. Ben learned the printing business from his brother but the political concerns from his father's dinner table.

The point I want to make is we have always had have's and have not's and there have always been debates about social justice. It does not seem just to me that men have gotten credit for the work of others, and those others are not given credit. Often it was the wife who was not given credit and even more often it was the person who actually made the discovery or actually did the work who did not get the credit. We have a made man system that results in there being so many have not's compared to the have's. Democracy is about enabling everyone to make their best contribution, but again I ask, did Ben build the barn or hire someone to build it? Perhaps if we word our explanations to give credit to the workers, we might see our way clear to change our system for greater social justice?
Athena is online now  
Old June 7th, 2018, 10:49 AM   #74
Senior Member
 
Twisted Sister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Brown Township, Ohio
Posts: 11,891
everyone is exactly where they want to be
Twisted Sister is offline  
Old June 7th, 2018, 10:51 AM   #75
I'm debt free
 
TNVolunteer73's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Lebanon, TN
Posts: 36,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Sister View Post
everyone is exactly where they want to be
or as a friend of mine would say "Where you are, there you be"
TNVolunteer73 is offline  
Old June 7th, 2018, 10:58 AM   #76
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,745
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNVolunteer73 View Post
Being teased because you have red hair is no less racist/Bigoted than being teased because you are black or white or yellow or red.
I do not believe having red hair is the same social or economic disadvantage of being a person of color. Especially not so for those who look like they have African ancestry. Slave owners demasculinized their slaves and destroyed their family ties, and they continued to call them "boy" and terrorize them into being submissive long after slavery. The memory of this is still with us, and the discrimination is not equal to having a red hair.

People with red hair do not have a history of injustice that should get an angry response.
Athena is online now  
Old June 7th, 2018, 11:01 AM   #77
Senior Member
 
Twisted Sister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Brown Township, Ohio
Posts: 11,891
Quote:
Originally Posted by Athena View Post
Did Ben build the barn or did he hire someone to build the barn?

This is a good bone to pick in a thread about being fair. In fact, now that I think about it, if my family were rich, my great grandson's identify problem would be very different. Money makes a huge difference in how we feel about ourselves and our position in the pecking order and how safe or threatened we feel.

Ben got his money by marrying a wealthy woman and then he abandoned her and played around in France until she died and he had to return to run his business himself. We might have never heard of Ben Franklin if he had not married a wealthy woman. His father was a candlestick maker who could not afford his children's education, so he invited important men in the city to dinner, and his children learned of life around the dinner table. Ben learned the printing business from his brother but the political concerns from his father's dinner table.

The point I want to make is we have always had have's and have not's and there have always been debates about social justice. It does not seem just to me that men have gotten credit for the work of others, and those others are not given credit. Often it was the wife who was not given credit and even more often it was the person who actually made the discovery or actually did the work who did not get the credit. We have a made man system that results in there being so many have not's compared to the have's. Democracy is about enabling everyone to make their best contribution, but again I ask, did Ben build the barn or hire someone to build it? Perhaps if we word our explanations to give credit to the workers, we might see our way clear to change our system for greater social justice?
The Barn is a burning mess. The Barn is where I killed my first gooks. The Barn was a dairy in Vietnam without giving details.
Twisted Sister is offline  
Old June 7th, 2018, 11:06 AM   #78
I'm debt free
 
TNVolunteer73's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Lebanon, TN
Posts: 36,150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Athena View Post
I do not believe having red hair is the same social or economic disadvantage of being a person of color. Especially not so for those who look like they have African ancestry. Slave owners demasculinized their slaves and destroyed their family ties, and they continued to call them "boy" and terrorize them into being submissive long after slavery. The memory of this is still with us, and the discrimination is not equal to having a red hair.

People with red hair do not have a history of injustice that should get an angry response.
old saying: "I am going to beat you like a redheaded step child" (Sayings and stereotypes have some basis in Reality,

Red hair is a an implication of to the Scotts and Irish people, this is an assumption not based in fact, but still you see red hair most think Scott or Irish decent.





bigotry racism is bigotry and racism

Last edited by TNVolunteer73; June 7th, 2018 at 11:09 AM.
TNVolunteer73 is offline  
Old June 7th, 2018, 11:08 AM   #79
end capitalism now
 
right to left's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,567
Quote:
Originally Posted by Athena View Post
Life has always been a little more complicated than your explanation and for sure the requirements today, and therefore the barriers, are much more challenging than they once were.

How did the colonist get land and what did they do with it to make a profit? Why was it believed owning land is essential liberty? What did slaves and the laboring immigrants have in common? How have things changed since the colonial days? What did Calvinism have to do with economic development and capitalism?

Later when the people moved west, how did they get land and what did they do with it?

It seems to me a simple fact you are missing is they got the resources for making a profit for free or nearly free. Indentured servants could buy their plantation when their period of being indentured was over. Pioneers got land simply by claiming it and working it. Equal opportunity meant the bounty of nature was there for anyone to take, and the first to get there, were the ones who got to make the claims on nature's bounty. This is no longer our reality.

What was required was only a willingness to work. That is no longer true. However, there also had to be connections with the old world and forms of transportation. But, no one needed a college education, and the skills, even specialized skills people learned, were so simple someone with the IQ of a moron could learn them. Much of the learning was done through apprenticeship, and this included room and board and some pay during the learning period. The father was responsible for his son's apprenticeship. Mothers trained their daughters in domestic skills and until industrialization, they were dependent on men. Even after industrialization women were dependent on men because the wages were so low and immigrants were exploited by the industrial owners and the landlords who owned housing. Because few had formal education, most were trapped in poverty.
Simpleminded conservatives always create these simpleminded historical narratives that try to excuse genocides, land-seizures and depopulation as God's Will...it's the ultimate 'we were just following orders' narrative...'God told us or our ancestors do it!'

So it was "God's Will" or their claimed "religious values" that made a great nation...created an empire. The real truth is that if you seize lands other people are living on for yourselves and bring in indentured slaves and then African slaves to do most of That Hard Work they brag about...prosperity is easy! Now, try to do it without exploiting others or destroying the natural environment!
right to left is offline  
Old June 7th, 2018, 11:11 AM   #80
end capitalism now
 
right to left's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Canada
Posts: 2,567
Quote:
Originally Posted by TNVolunteer73 View Post
or as a friend of mine would say "Where you are, there you be"
That makes a great excuse for "christians" to step over the bodies of increasing numbers of sleeping homeless people today!
Thanks from iolo
right to left is offline  
Reply

  Defending The Truth Political Forum > Political Issues > Social Issues

Tags
unfair



Thread Tools
Display Modes


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Unfair treatment! coke Current Events 0 February 25th, 2017 06:23 AM
Unfair Presidential Debate Randy71 Current Events 69 September 30th, 2016 06:49 AM
The Right To An Unfair Trial skews13 Civil Rights 6 April 12th, 2016 03:18 PM
Here's How Unfair The Tax System Is In Each State LongWinded Current Events 4 January 8th, 2015 12:24 AM
Our Unfair Way of Levying Taxes borden123 Taxes 45 February 28th, 2010 01:48 PM


Facebook Twitter RSS Feed



Copyright © 2005-2013 Defending The Truth. All rights reserved.