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Old January 17th, 2018, 09:43 AM   #171
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Take a look at China and Vietnam right now. Although in both cases their "communism" is a far cry from the Marx and Engels concept. They are more plutocracies.

Actually, even the good standby North Korea is more a dictatorship than communism.

About the closest to true communism the world has seen, IMO is Cuba till about 20 years ago.
For a similar example, if more extreme, compare the New Testament with the current 'Christian' United States. Cuba has at least a decent health service, and devotes serious efforts to dealing with typhoons, or whatever you call them.
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Old January 17th, 2018, 09:43 AM   #172
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Which means Cuba only worked until they ran out of Russia’s money.
You're funny !!! The US has had a strangle hold on the Cuban economy for more than 50 years now. But their failures are the result of a lack of soviet money ?? LOLOLOL

In his own way Castro won. For more than 50 years he stood toe to toe and and eyeball to eyeball with the great United States and never blinked. He went to his grave as defiant as the day he took power.

Of course the down side is his people have suffered for that defiance.

I have to wonder if raising the embargo and having full diplomatic and economic ties wouldn't have done far more to further our interests there ??
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Old January 24th, 2018, 09:03 AM   #173
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You're funny !!! The US has had a strangle hold on the Cuban economy for more than 50 years now. But their failures are the result of a lack of soviet money ?? LOLOLOL

In his own way Castro won. For more than 50 years he stood toe to toe and and eyeball to eyeball with the great United States and never blinked. He went to his grave as defiant as the day he took power.

Of course the down side is his people have suffered for that defiance.

I have to wonder if raising the embargo and having full diplomatic and economic ties wouldn't have done far more to further our interests there ??
According to the health and personal wellbeing statistics, the quality of life in Cuba did not suffer from the embargoes and being closed off from the forces of globalization other than tourism! And that reminds me of something I was going to post earlier regarding using GDP and especially - per capita GDP as the yardstick to measure any and everything in a society.

What should be obvious is that any activity that is not/or cannot be monetized, is effectively zero by using this method. So, all of the peasant farmers and livestock herders all over the world, that grow food for their own families and sell or trade the surplus at the local village market, are creating little or no economic value according to the beancounters...who lament their poverty...as if they give a shit! But, in every nation where the strategy of "clearing the commons" has been applied....starting in England three centuries ago, and now consuming what's left of Africa and Asia, has been forcing people off the land, either at the point of a gun or by simply flooding every local market with cheap grains and other high carb/low nutrition foods. In recent times, flooding the markets to clear the commons in the third world has gone on covertly under the guise of "food aid" when that Green Revolution bullshit was in full swing back 50 years ago...put that in your pipe and smoke it...all you rightwingers bitching about "supporting the rest of the world!" The Green Revolution that was kicked off by the Ford and Rockefeller Foundations was just part of the overt and covert strategies that force people off the land and into the cities to work in industrial sweatshops that just showed up and need lots of low cost workers. These people...whether we're talking Bangladesh, Haiti, Mexico, Vietnam or China are all of a sudden much richer according to the GDP valuations; because they now have to work for meagre wages, pay rent/rather than build some kind of house on ancestral land, and buy food..typically poor quality and even loaded with pathogens..but they are receiving and exchanging money every step of the way, and the neoliberal capitalist economists can look at GDP and per capita GDP numbers for a "booming" nation like Bangladesh and proclaim how wonderful their economic growth is. That per capita number is especially suspect when even Bangladesh has created a new class of billionaires in the midst of abject poverty!

But is their quality of life better after industrialization and being forced off the land? Not according to the people who have had to make the migration into the cities. All the bullshit we hear about capitalism promoting economic choice and freedom, and the people forced to leave the land feel like they've lost all their freedoms and become wage slaves! They have no choice about the hours they work or the working conditions, or the rent they pay for squalid rooms or apartments, or the dodgy cheapest foods they have to buy to feed themselves with.

So, when it comes back to the fight between Democrats and Republicans over whether to end the Embargo or re-open "free trade" with Cuba, I don't see good guy vs bad guy, just one form of capitalist despot vs another!

Last edited by right to left; January 24th, 2018 at 09:08 AM.
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