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Old March 30th, 2018, 08:13 AM   #1
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Discussing WWI & WWII

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Originally Posted by Athena
"...

"I hate wars for economic reasons and the glory of leaders. I think conscription should forever be forbidden and considered an international war crime."


Yah. I'm not sure that the US should have intervened in WWI - & when we did, we could have leveraged our supply & logistic & military power to try to correct some issues: Tear up the Sykes-Picot Agreement, defend defeated Germany against massive war reparations & dismemberment (in the interests of preventing WWII), & likely others. Pres. Wilson was unworldly - he'd have done much better to have treated Versailles as just more collegiate academics meeting to negotiate workloads.

In WWII, we didn't have much choice. Our policy was trending towards toward UK & allies, but Imperial Japan's attack upon Hawaii & the Philippines didn't leave us any alternative. & Germany also declared war upon us, so there you go.

I think we can justify a small nimble professional military establishment in the US in self-defense. One of the problems with a large standing military is that they get to competing for budget, personnel & mission-creep. If they're not kept sufficiently busy, they start lobbying for more & bigger slices of the military budget. It's a complicated puzzle for a republic, & requires a steady hand & cool eye in the executive & legislative branches - something we haven't had for a long time, especially in the legislative. Congress needs to become much more aggressive in defending its political turf, & actually thrashing out the issues of the day: budget, defense, national economic policy, agriculture, education & on & on - the tiresome minutiae of administration. It's what they're there for, isn't it?
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Old March 30th, 2018, 10:14 AM   #2
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Arguably the world's largest, most expensive military suits an empire far than it does a republic.

As you noted, when the military is this big, ya gotta find stuff for it to do.
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Old March 30th, 2018, 10:16 AM   #3
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Trump's referral to our "depleted" military is a measure of the power of the MIC.
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Old March 30th, 2018, 10:26 AM   #4
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Trump's referral to our "depleted" military is a measure of the power of the MIC.
I seriously think it is much more the fact that the Republican President knows how to play to the paranoia of the RW.

They just lap that up.
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Old March 30th, 2018, 11:18 AM   #5
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Trump's referral to our "depleted" military is a measure of the power of the MIC.
Jughead Obama did try and gut the military. You just be in denial over what the traitor did. I can post a lot of data on it but if you are a liberal it will be a waste of my time because liberals do not want to hear about what jughead did.
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Old March 30th, 2018, 11:30 AM   #6
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Jughead Obama did try and gut the military. You just be in denial over what the traitor did. I can post a lot of data on it but if you are a liberal it will be a waste of my time because liberals do not want to hear about what jughead did.
I'm no liberal or conservative. The parties have bastardized "liberal" and "conservative" to the point that the terms used in today's vernacular don't stand for one damned thing liberal or conservative. It's all power politics now, the country and the citizens be damned.

If you claim to be a conservative, the way that word is used now you insult yourself with your claim.

Please, when was the military "gutted" by Obama?

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Old March 30th, 2018, 11:37 AM   #7
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Arguably the world's largest, most expensive military suits an empire far than it does a republic.

As you noted, when the military is this big, ya gotta find stuff for it to do.
There is precedent for what's happening now....just read the history of how the Roman Republic morphed and changed into Roman Empire even prior to the formal announcement when General Julius Caesar declared himself emperor.

Once the early Rome Republic had gone from creating a federation with similar states in present day Italy to deciding that nations further away weren't worthy of being members of the club...and instead conquered and plundered and permanently enslaved to produce for Rome....that was pretty much the end of all the egalitarian virtues actually being practiced. The Republic became a functioning empire long before the formal declaration of empire, and instead of being a republic of free citizens, it became an empire ruled by an oligarchy of extremely wealthy men(even by today's standard) who faced occasional disruption from grumbling citizens and always on alert and paranoid about the prospects of slave revolt, as the population of slaves grew larger and larger......I can think of a few parallels with a modern self-proclaimed democratic republic that tries to act like the global empire that should control all the world's commerce today.
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Old March 30th, 2018, 11:51 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miketx View Post
Jughead Obama did try and gut the military. You just be in denial over what the traitor did. I can post a lot of data on it but if you are a liberal it will be a waste of my time because liberals do not want to hear about what jughead did.
Yeah, because having the capacity to carry on military operations in Iraq and Afghanistan simultaneously just screams “depletion”.........
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Old March 30th, 2018, 02:44 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by right to left View Post
There is precedent for what's happening now....just read the history of how the Roman Republic morphed and changed into Roman Empire even prior to the formal announcement when General Julius Caesar declared himself emperor.

Once the early Rome Republic had gone from creating a federation with similar states in present day Italy to deciding that nations further away weren't worthy of being members of the club...and instead conquered and plundered and permanently enslaved to produce for Rome....that was pretty much the end of all the egalitarian virtues actually being practiced. The Republic became a functioning empire long before the formal declaration of empire, and instead of being a republic of free citizens, it became an empire ruled by an oligarchy of extremely wealthy men(even by today's standard) who faced occasional disruption from grumbling citizens and always on alert and paranoid about the prospects of slave revolt, as the population of slaves grew larger and larger......I can think of a few parallels with a modern self-proclaimed democratic republic that tries to act like the global empire that should control all the world's commerce today.
Rome's debasement of its hard coinage is another parallel, as is the expansion of Roman welfare. Rome didn't need illegal immigrants like we do because it practiced outright slavery.
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Last edited by imaginethat; March 30th, 2018 at 02:48 PM.
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Old March 30th, 2018, 02:47 PM   #10
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Yeah, because having the capacity to carry on military operations in Iraq and Afghanistan simultaneously just screams “depletion”.........
Deployment is down, but we still have hundreds of thousands of soldiers deployed overseas.



As far as I'm concerned, that's cool.
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