Amber Guyger Guilty of murder

Jul 2019
4,829
2,480
Georgia
You're right, it is BS. They're not trained to shoot first. They just get scared of their own shadows, forget their training, and shoot first.
I'm sure every force is different, but it definitely happens in some police forces.

looks like it may be happening slightly less in the past few years, which is a good thihng

How Police Training Contributes to Avoidable Deaths

Police Are Trained to Fear

Police can use deadly force if they merely perceive a threat

Training Officers to Shoot First, and He Will Answer Questions Later

The Firing of an Officer Who Didn’t Shoot First and Ask Questions Later Reveals The Greater Failings of Law Enforcement in the US
 
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Nov 2018
4,914
2,611
Rocky Mountains
Did she ever explain WHY she thought it was HER apartment??
It was a multi-story apartment with multi-level parking. She didn't realize that she had parked on a level higher than her usual level and went to the apartment at the location of her own, but one level higher. Door keycard did not work but door swung open because it was not latched completely.
She entered and encountered Jean who she thought was an intruder/robber/burglar/whatever very late at night in her apt but he was in his own.
 
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Sep 2019
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She perceived (I suppose) that she was defending herself. If you agree that she was confused about the apartment, then it follows that she would perceive that she was defending herself. Of course, if she intentionally went to the wrong apartment, that would change the thinking. Her police training likely took over and she had a lethal weapon which she was encouraged to use based upon that training. Fire at center mass.
The thought wrong. She got scared. She overreacted. As too many cops are doing.

I suppose they've always done it. That's how/why they come up with a drop gun. It's harder for them to do that now, with cameras everywhere.
 
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Sep 2019
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I'm not sure what they're like now, but go find a couple of police forums. It's been a few years since I checked out any. But after reading some of the crap they post about "civilians," it's scary.
 
Nov 2018
4,914
2,611
Rocky Mountains
She lived on the third floor, for some reason she parked on the fourth floor of the garage, went to the apartment directly above hers, the door was unlocked, she entered he was there, she killed him.
She claimed he was coming towards her, and she was ordering him to stop, the forensic evidence showed he was shot while getting off the couch.
That's probably the murder charge there, she was lying about what happened.
Stupidity, inattention and poor judgment are more consistent with manslaughter than murder. She did not know him. There was no "reason" to kill.
Her response was to use lethal force as she was trained.... multiple rounds to center mass if there is perception of imminent threat to life of officer or others. She did not shoot to kill; she shot to stop him in defense of her own apartment. Maybe there was a thought that this act would look good-- shooting an intruder, maybe not. However her police job and training should have been central to her defense.
 
Nov 2018
4,914
2,611
Rocky Mountains
The thought wrong. She got scared. She overreacted. As too many cops are doing.

I suppose they've always done it. That's how/why they come up with a drop gun. It's harder for them to do that now, with cameras everywhere.
I am not trying to defend American police tactics. However, as you note, it seems that all too often, police respond out of proportion to the circumstances when those circumstances can be seen objectively. That is American law enforcement.... multiple rounds to center mass to stop the threat.
 
Nov 2018
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Rocky Mountains
It is interesting to think about this Amber Guyger scenario from a few different configurarions:

1. white male cop, young black male victim
2. black male cop, white female victim
3. black female cop, white male victim
4. white female cop, white female victim

I suspect the underlying atmosphere of the department was that females are inferior cops.
She was a new cop as I recall. It is entirely possible that Guyger was influenced by a need to prove her ability to use lethal force. However, that should be seen as a problem with the department and hostile work environment, not entirely her fault.
 
Sep 2019
913
558
Here
It is interesting to think about this Amber Guyger scenario from a few different configurarions:

1. white male cop, young black male victim
2. black male cop, white female victim
3. black female cop, white male victim
4. white female cop, white female victim

I suspect the underlying atmosphere of the department was that females are inferior cops.
She was a new cop as I recall. It is entirely possible that Guyger was influenced by a need to prove her ability to use lethal force. However, that should be seen as a problem with the department and hostile work environment, not entirely her fault.
You're thinking waaaaaaay too much into this. She walked into the wrong apartment, got the sht scared out of her, overreacted and killed the guy who lived there.
 
Nov 2018
4,914
2,611
Rocky Mountains
You're thinking waaaaaaay too much into this. She walked into the wrong apartment, got the sht scared out of her, overreacted and killed the guy who lived there.
That is not murder. That is manslaughter. She was convicted of murder. Broadly, the circumstances are no different from the many police involved shootings that prove to be bad judgment. I think it is entirely reasonable to wonder why this officer was convicted of murder.
 
May 2018
7,017
4,836
Chicago
That is not murder. That is manslaughter. She was convicted of murder. Broadly, the circumstances are no different from the many police involved shootings that prove to be bad judgment. I think it is entirely reasonable to wonder why this officer was convicted of murder.
So if I walk into my neighbor's house, thinking it is my own and kill them, it's just manslaughter? I mean, it kind of looked like my house after all. I don't have to ask why they might be there? Ya know, like they own the place? Are you serious?

Does what you're saying mean that I can be killed by my neighbor just because they thought they lived in my house, therefore they are somehow justified in killing me? Are we really having this conversation?

I'm sorry, but NO. No one should ever enter someone else's residence and be able to kill them. This woman did not even stop to think. She just acted. If someone came into your house and did this to you and your family, would you really argue manslaughter? Seriously?

My god, I cannot even believe this is a debate.

This woman walked into someone's apartment that was not hers and killed them. That is the bottom line. That's murder. She trespassed on someone else's property and killed someone for NO reason. Or maybe you think Botham Jean had no right to expect to be safe in his home?

If someone walks into your house thinking it's theirs and kills you, you don't think that's murder? Explain that to me. If someone did that to my roommate, cop or otherwise, I'd call for murder too, as there was no justification whatsoever. You would too. Don't lie.
 
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