Chilling World War III 'wargames' show US forces crushed by Russia and China

Nov 2012
40,609
11,697
Lebanon, TN
#41
That was initially YOUR error, like so many others. From now on, I'm fact checking every last thing you post.
No it was not post 18 is where pershing missiles were mentioned, I thought it was you but it was ClickerII that stated they were Pershing the reason I got confused and thought it was you he had quoted YOUR post in his post. I accepted the fact the pershing was the system that was removed instead, I new we removed missiles it was the Jupiter instead of pershing.

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Dec 2018
1,207
697
Unionville Indiana
#42
No it was not post 18 is where pershing missiles were mentioned, I thought it was you but it was ClickerII that stated they were Pershing the reason I got confused and thought it was you he had quoted YOUR post in his post. I accepted the fact the pershing was the system that was removed instead, I new we removed missiles it was the Jupiter instead of pershing.

View attachment 3251
Thanks for your clarification. (Poor JFK...he was under incredible pressure to nuke the hell out of Cuba from his Joint Chiefs of Staff knowing full well that it would trigger WW III with the Soviets. Thank God he found a way out.)
 
Nov 2012
40,609
11,697
Lebanon, TN
#43
Thanks for your clarification. (Poor JFK...he was under incredible pressure to nuke the hell out of Cuba from his Joint Chiefs of Staff knowing full well that it would trigger WW III with the Soviets. Thank God he found a way out.)

I agree the right person in the right place at the right time
 
Nov 2013
2,491
1,061
NM
#44
Define "best."

And these war games scenarios are a joke. Just as soon as either side began getting their asses whipped out would come nuclear weapons.
Yah, the Soviets thought that way - but then, they anticipated being the aggressors, punching armored units through the Fulda Gap, & carrying out deep penetration raids/strikes against NATO depots, bases & ports. I don't recall that the USSR ever truly gave up the notion of first nuclear strike - I'd have to look. The Soviets hoped that the US & European NATO would hesitate over nuking Central or even Eastern Europe - lots of sunk costs there in terms of infrastructure, cropland, population centers.

The play for China in Taiwan would be riskier - I've followed David Poyer's series on the modern US Navy - he's an excellent writer, think the Horatio Hornblower series set in real world, or slightly ahead. His last novels -

 
Likes: imaginethat
Mar 2013
9,634
10,328
Middle Tennessee
#45
China has the same problem the Japanese had in the late 1930s. They have a dynamic production machine but their oil is virtually all imported. Oil is still the blood of industry and the military no matter the dreams and musings of the Socialists in our Congress.
China did not start importing oil until the 1990s. They, just like us, have oil. just not enough to fully support their economy. They are also stockpiling strategic reserves from what I can see. Does it truly not occur to people that China will need more oil and if they can't buy it, they may just take military actions to obtain it ?? Was not one of Japan's major reasons for entering WW2 the fact that was had convinced China NOT to sell them oil ??

A few years ago when the navy announced it was putting serious effort into the study and development of alternative fuels, it was the neo-cons that howled about what a waste of money and resources such a program would be.
 
Likes: imaginethat
Oct 2010
67,033
27,054
Colorado
#46
you are correct there was an error type of missile removed.. Pershings were not removed from turkey, Jupiter Missiles were removed in 1963 from turkey in the agreement.

PGM-19 Jupiter - Wikipedia



I knew the missiles removed were Obsolete systems, RB lead me down the path that it was the Pershings removed.... ...
now all is well in the world.
Amazing. You quote to me what I quoted to you.

Amazing. Thanks for quoting me to tell me I was right. Thanks.
 
Nov 2012
40,609
11,697
Lebanon, TN
#47
Amazing. You quote to me what I quoted to you.

Amazing. Thanks for quoting me to tell me I was right. Thanks.
As I said I was mistaken.. ClickerII said they were pershing missiles removed... you said the pershings were deployed in 1963.... I took what clickerii said as gospel.. he was mistaken and it rolled down hill.

I quoted back to you what you quoted to me beause I was agreeing with you... AND THANKED YOU FOR THE CORRECTION.
 
Nov 2013
2,491
1,061
NM
#48
You're forgetting, or don't know, about JFK removing U.S. missiles from Turkey as part of the quid pro quo arrangement. That part of the deal was secretly negotiated through a back channel in the press and was kept from the public. Unlike the RW, then and now, JFK was a cryptic peacenik.
Yah, those were Jupiters, nuclear-armed, in Turkey & Italy. The Pershings were removed from Europe in 1988, after the signing of the Intermediate Nuclear Forces Treaty - long after JFK was gone.
 
Sep 2017
2,142
1,094
Hell
#49
China did not start importing oil until the 1990s. They, just like us, have oil. just not enough to fully support their economy. They are also stockpiling strategic reserves from what I can see. Does it truly not occur to people that China will need more oil and if they can't buy it, they may just take military actions to obtain it ?? Was not one of Japan's major reasons for entering WW2 the fact that was had convinced China NOT to sell them oil ??
Um......China was fighting Japan since 1931. The ones selling oil to Japan for their fight against China were Britain and US. The Allies stopped selling them oil when Japan invaded Vietnam - Vichy France. Prior to China's industrial age, her oil output was measured in quarts.

A few years ago when the navy announced it was putting serious effort into the study and development of alternative fuels, it was the neo-cons that howled about what a waste of money and resources such a program would be.
The only alternative other than more nuclear was advanced bio-diesel which was costing the US Navy $26/gallon. An Arleigh-Burke class destroyer burns a minimum of 1000 gallons an hour without factoring high speed, hard maneuvering, rough seas, battle stations, etc. The price of crude will have to be very well north of $1000/barrel before that makes any logical economic sense.
 
Likes: hoosier88
Nov 2013
2,491
1,061
NM
#50
China did not start importing oil until the 1990s. They, just like us, have oil. just not enough to fully support their economy. They are also stockpiling strategic reserves from what I can see. Does it truly not occur to people that China will need more oil and if they can't buy it, they may just take military actions to obtain it ?? Was not one of Japan's major reasons for entering WW2 the fact that was had convinced China NOT to sell them oil ??

...
Imperial Japan had been nibbling @ Korea, Manchuria, China (Vietnam, Taiwan, etc.) from the late 1800s. IJ was an up & coming imperial power - or @ least, they wanted to be. They seriously overreached, to the point that they warred on UK, France, Netherlands, China, USSR, US simultaneously.
 

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