Conservative apologizes for ignoring a Christian right-wing takeover of the GOP — which led to Trump

Sep 2018
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cleveland ohio
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Likes: tristanrobin
Feb 2019
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here and there
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In these sentiments, Sir, I agree to this Constitution with all its faults, if they are such; because I think a general Government necessary for us, and there is no form of Government but what may be a blessing to the people if well administered, and believe farther that this is likely to be well administered for a course of years, and can only end in Despotism, as other forms have done before it, when the people shall become so corrupted as to need despotic Government, being incapable of any other.

Ben Franklin

Ben knew that only a moral people could be a free people. In other words, monitor your own actions in a moral way or the state will be forced to do it for you in order to maintain a civil society.

Hence the need for religious texts like the Bible.
 
Feb 2019
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"God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the Gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that His justice cannot sleep forever..."

Thomas Jefferson

So if God should be kept of public discourse relating to inalienable rights, then what are these rights based upon other than the whim of man?
 
Sep 2018
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cleveland ohio
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"God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the Gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that His justice cannot sleep forever..."

Thomas Jefferson

So if God should be kept of public discourse relating to inalienable rights, then what are these rights based upon other than the whim of man?
“The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.”
—John Adams


Founding Fathers: We Are Not a Christian Nation | HuffPost
 
Likes: Gordy
Feb 2019
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“The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.”
—John Adams


Founding Fathers: We Are Not a Christian Nation | HuffPost
You like John Adams, eh?

"Suppose a nation in some distant Region should take the Bible for their only law Book, and every member should regulate his conduct by the precepts there exhibited! Every member would be obliged in conscience, to temperance, frugality, and industry; to justice, kindness, and charity towards his fellow men; and to piety, love, and reverence toward Almighty God ... What a Eutopia, what a Paradise would this region be."
--Diary and Autobiography of John Adams, Vol. III, p. 9.

To say that the Founding Fathers were not heavily influenced by the Bible regarding their political philosophy is a grave mistake. Naturally, they had just escaped the clutches of England where the state preached from the pulpit, something they swore would not happen in the US, so they refused to endorse any type of state religion.
 
Dec 2018
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Unionville Indiana
#7
"God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the Gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that His justice cannot sleep forever..."

Thomas Jefferson

So if God should be kept of public discourse relating to inalienable rights, then what are these rights based upon other than the whim of man?
Here are two quotations that more accurately reflect Jefferson's complex attitudes about Christianity and religion in general:

... I inquire after no man's [God] and trouble none with mine; nor is it given to us in this life to know whether your’s or mine, our friend’s or our foe’s are exactly the right. ... --
Thomas Jefferson to Miles King, 26 September 1814.

...shake off all the fears and servile prejudices, under which weak minds are servilely crouched. Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call to her tribunal every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a god; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason, than that of blindfolded fear. ... -- Jefferson to Peter Carr, 10 August 1787.

And keep in mind that "Jefferson envisioned a state-supported and state-sponsored educational system in which the influence of any single denomination, or of all together for that matter, would be minimized". -- Sworn on the Altar of God. (1996) Edwin Gaustad. p.149.

Robert Baird (1798-1863), the Jerry Falwell of his day, characterized Jefferson, in 1844, as "a very bitter enemy to Christianity, one of the greatest enemies that Christianity has ever had to contend with in America." (Gaustad. p. 216)
 
Mar 2013
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Middle Tennessee
#8
Ben knew that only a moral people could be a free people. In other words, monitor your own actions in a moral way or the state will be forced to do it for you in order to maintain a civil society. Hence the need for religious texts like the Bible.
Religion has done far more to divide people than unite them. The ONLY absolute rule we need to be descent, ethical even moral people, is the Golden Rule. A concept which has existed in almost every society since the beginning of time. Certainly predating Christianity by thousands of years. In this country it is, more often than not, the supposedly religious that want to use their religion to strip away rights for those with whom they disagree.

So if God should be kept of public discourse relating to inalienable rights, then what are these rights based upon other than the whim of man?
Our form of government, which is a terrible way to run a country, except for all the others, was created long before Jesus ever walked the planet. As were the concepts that citizens have certain inalienable, or another word would be inherent, rights. Nobody needs God to tell them they have these rights. We all know it instinctively. I'm just glad I live a country that chooses to recognize those rights.