Europeans in Ukraine will be divested of rights

Jun 2019
1
0
Amsterdam
passports.jpg
Foreign passports as well as other supporting documents confirming belonging to the neighbour nation (for instance, the Polish card entitles the owner to obtain Polish citizenship within a year) granted to Ukrainians after 2014 become void. This could be expected reaction on the offer of Russian passports to Ukrainian citizens through a simplified procedure. However, this action turned out to be developed by the Poroshenko's team long before Ukrainian presidential election 2019.

This is described in informal Whatsapp conversation between Mustafa Nayyem and Maria Ionova, members of the Ukrainian parliament for Petro Poroshenko bloc. The conversation issue is about development of some campaign by the former president's team. It is concerned passports and trouble for Poles and Hungarians all at once.

Ukrainian legislation strictly and explicitly prohibits dual citizenship. However, due to the further contradictory formulation of the law, it may be concluded that that's punishable just in case of admission of guilt and voluntary presenting the relevant paper. That is why statistics on the number of holders of multiple nationalities is very rough in Ukraine. It depends entirely on information provided by the other side. Thus, Romania conceals this data.

In such a manner hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians consequently apply a popular national principle "innocent till proven guilty. Many of them have regarded as a guideline for the activities wide national policy of European integration. As a result, about 100 thousands of Ukrainians had obtained Hungarian citizenship by spring 2015. More than 150 thousands others were granted temporary or permanent residence permits in Poland. By the most modest estimates, there are more than 500 thousands of people with dual citizenship living in Ukraine.

As indicated in the conversation, Poroshenko's political cadres were given the task of reduction of Ukrainian labour outflow to foreign countries. On the sly, Petro Oleksiuovych's team was developing new legislation limiting Ukranians' right to self-determination while he talked about "Ukraine becomes a part of the European labour market" through labout migration. Besides, those deputies who's in the those of their stolen achievements for services to the Fatherland forget that that their sweated and bled project also affects democratic freedoms of newly citizens of Poland, Hungary and other countries nationality of which Ukrainians had adopted in recent five years.

Such an approach to problem of dual citizenship moves Ukraine further and further away from the European integration involving it into a tangle of international scandals and burdening neighbour relations. With that drafting, those members of the Verkhovna Rada have done a disservice to Zelensky. Dual citizenship is an everyday practice in the EU. An uncompromising prohibition of self-determination is taken as a symptom of totalitarian dictatorship without any chances for equal co-operation with European countries and NATO membership.

Mr. Zelensky gets to choose.
 
Jun 2018
1,276
477
Toronto
While I agree that dual citizenship is good, These EU countries do not allow it:

Austria, Czech Republic, Estonia, Latvia, Slovakia, Lithuania, Netherlands
 

imaginethat

Forum Staff
Oct 2010
70,611
31,044
Colorado
While I agree that dual citizenship is good, These EU countries do not allow it:

Austria, Czech Republic, Estonia, Latvia, Slovakia, Lithuania, Netherlands
With the exception of the Netherlands and Austria, these are all former Soviet Bloc member states.

That's one reason why dual citizenship isn't allowed.
 
Jun 2018
1,276
477
Toronto
With the exception of the Netherlands and Austria, these are all former Soviet Bloc member states.

That's one reason why dual citizenship isn't allowed.

Nope, the reason they are not allowing dual citizenship is because of potential problems with minorities.

The Baltic states are very much exactly in the Ukrainian situation, they have sizeable russian minorities and they fear that a large group with russian passports could be used as justification for russian meddling up to a Crimean style invasion.

The Czech Republic and Slovakia just peacefully split off from Czechoslovakia, which ceased to exist, so they want people to decide where they belong to.

Netherlands may actually move to allow dual citizenship.

The guy is a russian troll, trying to trash talk Ukraine, nothing new, I'm moving along

:)
 

imaginethat

Forum Staff
Oct 2010
70,611
31,044
Colorado
Nope, the reason they are not allowing dual citizenship is because of potential problems with minorities.

The Baltic states are very much exactly in the Ukrainian situation, they have sizeable russian minorities and they fear that a large group with russian passports could be used as justification for russian meddling up to a Crimean style invasion.

The Czech Republic and Slovakia just peacefully split off from Czechoslovakia, which ceased to exist, so they want people to decide where they belong to.

Netherlands may actually move to allow dual citizenship.

The guy is a russian troll, trying to trash talk Ukraine, nothing new, I'm moving along

:)
Sorry I wasn't more clear. What I meant was, every nation that was a former Soviet state doesn't want the Russians to have any excuses to "meddle" in their country ... to "protect" Russian citizens.

It's amazing to me that pint-sized DTT actually attracts occasional Russian trolls, in addition to a couple of suspect residents. It shows the reach of the Russians. They sure as hell worked for Trump in 2016 and almost certainly helped him to win. They'll do it again in 2020.

Trump not doing enough to thwart
Russian 2020 meddling, experts say
Intelligence warnings are growing that Russia will probably meddle in the 2020 elections, but Donald Trump and a powerful Senate ally are downplaying these concerns and not doing enough to thwart interfering, say Russia and cyber experts and key congressional Democrats.​
Despite fears that Moscow may seek to influence the 2020 elections by launching cyber-attacks, social media disinformation, covert agent operations and other “active measures” as it did in the 2016 election, adequate funding and White House focus to counter any new Russian meddling are lagging, experts and officials say.​
Election security concerns that critics say require more resources and attention include: a paper ballot system to replace or back up electronic voting machines vulnerable to hacking; more resources and attention for cybersecurity programs at the Department of Homeland Security (DHS); a requirement that campaigns report to the FBI any contacts with foreign nationals; and a strong public commitment from the president to an interference-free election.​
Federal efforts to beef up election security, critics say, have been undercut by Trump’s apparent willingness to accept the word of the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, word that the country did not interfere in 2016, and Trump’s slighting of intelligence community conclusions about Russian meddling.​
“Russia would be remiss not to try again, given how successful they were in 2016,” said Steven Hall, a retired chief of the CIA’s Russian operations.​

More: Trump not doing enough to thwart Russian 2020 meddling, experts say
 
Dec 2013
33,811
19,364
Beware of watermelons
So the chocolate king was worried that the people may want to go home to mother?
 
Jun 2018
1,276
477
Toronto
Sorry I wasn't more clear. What I meant was, every nation that was a former Soviet state doesn't want the Russians to have any excuses to "meddle" in their country ... to "protect" Russian citizens.
Russians have minorities only in the neighbouring countries e.g. the Baltics and Ukraine. The russians have proven historically that they are very protective of other russians and invade non-russian populated territories only when attacked: Napoleon, Hitler, the russians went there only for a short period of time and then returned back to russia.

So apart from Ukraine and the Baltics eastern europeans are not afraid of russian invasion.

However the russians have the policy of supporting local nationalists and/or parties on the extreme spectrum, both left and right against the interests of the core population. This is what most of the eastern europeans hate and resent russians for.

It's a pattern they apply in the west too: Trump, Farage, Le Penn are all fringe politicians that became mainstream with russian help.
 
Jun 2019
14
2
Suomelinen
- украина - це Еуропа
- с голой дупою холопа
- посмотрите, что с ней стало?
- и куда девалось САЛО?
 
Jun 2018
1,276
477
Toronto
- украина - це Еуропа
- с голой дупою холопа
- посмотрите, что с ней стало?
- и куда девалось САЛО?

Finland eh? Sure, sure.

:)

I don't know about the Ukrainian bacon, but enjoy something here: