How do we reduce the number of mass shootings?

Nov 2018
3,739
1,836
Inner Space
Such dishonesty and factually DISPROVEN in this thread!
Here would be where LTP reminds us of his mistaken understanding of a misrepresentation of firearm data posted by the charlatan John Lott, no doubt. Or he will decide that because some country, somewhere, at some point in history had MORE mass murders than the US, then the US does not have a problem. Or some other silly misrepresentation of years of firearm studies (in spite of the Dickey Amendment) that show that firearms cause preventable firearm injuries in the US.
 
Sep 2015
13,979
5,037
Brown Township, Ohio
Here would be where LTP reminds us of his mistaken understanding of a misrepresentation of firearm data posted by the charlatan John Lott, no doubt. Or he will decide that because some country, somewhere, at some point in history had MORE mass murders than the US, then the US does not have a problem. Or some other silly misrepresentation of years of firearm studies (in spite of the Dickey Amendment) that show that firearms cause preventable firearm injuries in the US.
Don't forget about Genghis Khan who wheeled west thus avoiding Vietnam. Genghis Khan made a foray into Vietnam but none his troops or diplomats came back alive.
 
Last edited:
Mar 2018
679
132
Grayson
Oh, so now the "frequency" is the problem... not the act itself. I see.

Good talk.
Did I interpret their response correctly? How many times an act happens versus how many people are killed is irrelevant? The left's objective is gun control. It has nothing at all to do with saving lives. If we implemented gun control and ended up with more deaths, the left would be as happy as a pig in slop.

Since the left likes to go off topic to make a point, allow me.

On a world wide scale, the United States was behind 22 countries in the number of terrorist incidents in one year (2017.) The United States lost 932 people in 65 terrorist attacks. In the Philippines they lost 2091 of their citizens in 719 attacks.

Number of terrorist incidents by country - Wikipedia

Between civilians and military, there are only around 5 million firearms in the Philippines. The death rate by firearms is 7.68 per 100,000 people. But, the death rate is WAY the Hell greater than in the United States. The death rate by firearms in the United States is 11.8 per 100,000 people

Guns in the Philippines — Firearms, gun law and gun control

Firearm death rates in the United States by state - Wikipedia

So, we have over 400 million firearms and FOUR times the people as in the Philippines, but the Philippines lose more that TWICE the number of people we do to violent deaths. I guess since they are not gun related deaths, it's all cool. It's not about saving lives. And we ask many questions to extrapolate what makes the two countries different and what would happen if we eliminated firearms in the United States.

There is a reason that Americans consume 80 percent of the world's opioids; a reason we have more people in prisons than any nation on earth - both in terms of raw numbers and per capita; a reason there are more drug addicts in prisons than mental health facilities. There is a reason that SSRIs are associated with almost all those mass shootings that are not related to political jihadists.

I used the differences between us and ONE country. BTW, it's the second country I've compared the stats to. IF THE OBJECTIVE IS TO SAVE LIVES, THE LEFT CANNOT SHOW BY EVEN THE REMOTEST "EVIDENCE" THAT GUN CONTROL WILL SAVE LIVES. In the case of the United States, gun control would increase deaths because of a number of reasons:

* Political extremists (and the United States has more than any other country) would have nothing to deter them

* Possibly hundreds of thousands if not maybe a number in the millions of gun owners would stand firm and refuse to be disarmed

* Racial groups would feel empowered and be emboldened to advocate violence

* Foreign countries that envy the United States would feel more confident about taking this country. No foreign power really wants to take on the United States. With our unorganized militia, the United States has the most ground forces of any nation on this planet

The left always wants to yap about third world cesspools that nobody gives a rat's rear about. The United States is different. We are the beacon of Liberty and Freedom. We have troops all over the world protecting the Freedoms of foreign nations. It makes no sense to bring the United States down to the level of third world sh!+holes unless your objective is to make America a socialist nation. That, IMO, is treason.

Tyrants all over the globe would want to take the U.S. Tyrants don't really give a damn about some of these other countries the left spouts about. And, adding insult to injury, the left might be exposing themselves a bit here.

Japan has gun control and a low rate of violence. Nobody wants to take over Japan, but there is an obvious they don't have some of the issues we have - they claim to be the most racially pure nation on the earth. Does the left advocate racial supremacy or something equivalent thereto?

I could make this discussion go on and on, but bottom line is that there is no evidence that gun control would save lives.

Chart of the day: More guns, less gun violence between 1993 and 2013 - AEI

While a few years old, people are wondering about the uptick in recent years of run related deaths. I suppose the undeclared war between the Muslims and Americans wasn't factored in nor the increase in SSRIs being prescribed. We're all sure firearm deaths aren't related to the immigration issue (sarcasm intended.) The demise of the American family and relationships don't have anything to do with it either (rolling my eyes if you believe that one.)

Outlaw guns, restrict them, whatever - if people use knives or bombs (like in the Philippines) dead is freaking dead. But we can identify most mass shooters and we can take the bulk of those statistics off the table. But this isn't about saving lives; it is about CONTROL.
 
Likes: Sabcat
Nov 2018
3,739
1,836
Inner Space
I could make this discussion o on and on, but bottom line is that there is no evidence that gun control would save lives.
There is plenty of evidence that guns promote death and injury. So, logically, one can conclude that fewer guns will result in less death and injury.
This is well proven in the medical literature. Of course, having presented this information previously and had it ignored, I do not expect LTP to accept scientific studies or medical literature as significant or believable.

Chart of the day: More guns, less gun violence between 1993 and 2013 - AEI
This is common misleading pro-gun propaganda that can be criticized on many level but most significantly for two reasons:
There is no causal connection between the variables established and, secondly, the charts conveniently ignore the data BEFORE 1994. From 1950 there was increasing firearms in the country AND there was increasing crime. The increase in firearm prevalence was associated with worsening crime during that interval before 1994. As, even in this "jiggered" graph from "Ammoland" (which has other problems):


 
Dec 2016
5,085
2,611
Canada
How about we give everyone a gun...even children, and everyone must have their gun loaded and ready to fire. So, if someone attempts a mass shooting like in New Zealand, dozens of adults and children will start shooting back at the gunman........and hopefully not kill anyone else in the crossfire!
 
Feb 2019
1,417
317
here and there
Conservatives are quick to say “Gun control” is not the answer but do not offer any solutions.
On another thread I was challenged;



So here we are.
Ok, I'll play this game.

How do we limit the number of fatal car crashes? Anyone?

How bout we outlaw cars? That would work.

The issue here is freedom. Do we want a free society? Can we trust people? I suppose if society deteriorates to the point of not have moral above that in a jail cell, then the only thing to do to that society is take their weapons and build a wall around them and hire a warden.

In fact, jail is the Left wing utopia. Everyone has the same living arrangements and are not allowed to own large houses that are not carbon friendly, they are not allowed to drive around in carbon producing vehicles, they all dress the same and everyone eats the same things. In fact, it is the most egalitarian of societies as everyone is forced into equality. Not only is it a gun free zone with free medical, and free everything without having to work for any of it, every day is gay pride day.

As for being a conservative, that is why I am a conservative. As Ben Franklin aptly pointed out, the Constitution will last just as long as the country has any moral fiber to it. Once it becomes too corrupted, the Constitution will either be ignored or repealed.

So far, the Left is trying to repeal the Second Amendment as they wage war on the moral fiber of society. In fact, I think they know that waging war on the moral fabric of society is the best way to bring about their utopia.
 
Nov 2018
3,739
1,836
Inner Space
Ok, I'll play this game.

How do we limit the number of fatal car crashes? Anyone?

How bout we outlaw cars? That would work.

The issue here is freedom. Do we want a free society? Can we trust people? I suppose if society deteriorates to the point of not have moral above that in a jail cell, then the only thing to do to that society is take their weapons and build a wall around them and hire a warden.

In fact, jail is the Left wing utopia. Everyone has the same living arrangements and are not allowed to own large houses that are not carbon friendly, they are not allowed to drive around in carbon producing vehicles, they all dress the same and everyone eats the same things. In fact, it is the most egalitarian of societies as everyone is forced into equality. Not only is it a gun free zone with free medical, and free everything without having to work for any of it, every day is gay pride day.

As for being a conservative, that is why I am a conservative. As Ben Franklin aptly pointed out, the Constitution will last just as long as the country has any moral fiber to it. Once it becomes too corrupted, the Constitution will either be ignored or repealed.

So far, the Left is trying to repeal the Second Amendment as they wage war on the moral fiber of society. In fact, I think they know that waging war on the moral fabric of society is the best way to bring about their utopia.
That is rather a rambling and unfocused philippic that has only the central idea of "guns = freedom" and "freedom = guns".
Somehow this society has managed to survive without readily available full auto firearms. Why is that?
While you are puzzling over that question, perhaps you can explain this puzzle. Why do you think that MORE firearms will improve life in the US since the public health responses to auto accidents, drunk driving and smoking did not involve promoting MORE alcohol and tobacco and unsafe driving?
 
Mar 2018
679
132
Grayson
Ok, I'll play this game.

How do we limit the number of fatal car crashes? Anyone?

How bout we outlaw cars? That would work.

The issue here is freedom. Do we want a free society? Can we trust people? I suppose if society deteriorates to the point of not have moral above that in a jail cell, then the only thing to do to that society is take their weapons and build a wall around them and hire a warden.

In fact, jail is the Left wing utopia. Everyone has the same living arrangements and are not allowed to own large houses that are not carbon friendly, they are not allowed to drive around in carbon producing vehicles, they all dress the same and everyone eats the same things. In fact, it is the most egalitarian of societies as everyone is forced into equality. Not only is it a gun free zone with free medical, and free everything without having to work for any of it, every day is gay pride day.

As for being a conservative, that is why I am a conservative. As Ben Franklin aptly pointed out, the Constitution will last just as long as the country has any moral fiber to it. Once it becomes too corrupted, the Constitution will either be ignored or repealed.

So far, the Left is trying to repeal the Second Amendment as they wage war on the moral fiber of society. In fact, I think they know that waging war on the moral fabric of society is the best way to bring about their utopia.
You make a great point. Despite the fact that cigarettes cost 450,000 lives per year, I remember as a kid that my grandparents got government subsidies to grow... tobacco.

And, despite the fact that cars are involved in more fatalities than firearms, did the government not bail out car manufacturers with tax money?

On this thread the left has failed to support the idea of implementing laws that would reduce firearm deaths without gun control. I'm not surprised. They don't even want to implement those measures to see IF they work so they can say I told you so in the event they don't produce results... BECAUSE the measures presented address the issues and would work. That would eliminate any pretext for gun control.
 
Likes: Sabcat

Similar Discussions