Invasion of people headed to the US brings many questions. To start...does anyone actually

Dec 2014
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Memphis, Tn.
For the last fucking time, until I mentioned it, not one time did you even pretend to act like there was any other nation involved in South American or Central American influence but the USA. You absolutely did place all the blame on the USA. Every bit of it, until I called you out.
Sincerely
Done
Bull-fucking-shit.
 
Likes: Clara007
Nov 2012
5,269
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Kekistan
Bull-fucking-shit.
You are more than welcome to show where what I said was incorrect at anytime, in this thread, by bringing to light, any reference to a nation besides the USA involved in CA and SA nations before I mentioned the Soviet influence.
 
Feb 2014
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Oregon
For the last fucking time, until I mentioned it, not one time did you even pretend to act like there was any other nation involved in South American or Central American influence but the USA. You absolutely did place all the blame on the USA. Every bit of it, until I called you out.
Sincerely
Done
Will that really be the last time or did you just saying that like the phone solicitors who say that hoping to hook us into buying whatever they are selling. Personally, when people use offensive language I do hope it will be the last time.
 
Feb 2014
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Oregon
Overpopulation is mostly a phony concern, because population declines when young people in their prime reproductive years see children as becoming more of a burden/than a benefit to them. Traditionally, in mostly patriarchal agrarian societies that covered the planet until the last two centuries, children were the pension and old age security system...the more children you had, the better your retirement would be late in life!

Today, population growth rates are declining all over the world...even in the poorest countries...where the shift to cash-cropping and sweatshop industrial production has made raising children more costly and more perilous. The Earth won't die because of Malthusian fears of population explosion....it will be because of the increasing speed of environmental disaster if nuclear war doesn't take us out first!

Among the stories that rightwing crazies haven't heard of yet is:
1. Climate change is already having an impact....causing droughts and floods forcing people off farmland and looking to migrate elsewhere....and everyone north of the Equator is going to be migrating or trying to migrate north! This has been something known and understood by the US Government since at least 2000, when Gwyn Dyer wrote "Climate Wars" detailing his discussions with his contacts within the CIA and State Dept apparatus at a time when Denier In Chief was GW Bush! The one question I wanted Dyer to ask them and wasn't apparently is especially relevant now with a Trump in the White House: What will the US Government do when even larger movements of migrants are forced out of the tropics by rising temperatures and trying to move north...along with the animal and bird migrations....who don't respect or understand unnatural boundaries either!

Changing climate forces desperate Guatemalans to migrate
Mostly the same story in India:

India’s Farmers Plan Mass March to the Nation’s Parliament as Agrarian Crisis Reaches “Civilization Proportions”
2. In the immediate future, refugee migrations should be the least of our problems.
Of course they won't as long as there are racial purists and such in the world, but it looks like the US has the same problem of an aging population with a demographic bulge as Japan experienced first, China is facing now...along with Europe, while in Canada, we're dealing with the demographic imbalance by expanding immigration over the last 10 years. I can really see Republicans getting behind that one!

Taibbi: Russia’s Biggest Problem Will Soon Be Ours

On Thursday, the Russian Duma held its first reading of a new bill: “On the Citizenship of the Russian Federation.” According to the newspaper Kommersant, the government has prepared a paper representing a “first step toward a serious review of immigration policy.” Included is the idea that:​
Russia should be open not only to Russians and Russian speakers, but to anyone who is loyal and willing to integrate into Russian society.
Russia, you see, has a serious problem with population decline. They’re expecting a 28 percent plunge in women of childbearing age by 2032. Their population peaked at about 148 million, in 1991.​
You might notice that as the year of the collapse of communism. After the revolution, a series of factors — including introduction to the joys of international capitalism, with the accompanying loss of free health care, spiking economic inequality, accelerated substance abuse, etc. — caused Russia to begin shrinking..............................................................​
Meanwhile, here in America, the entire country is up in arms about a caravan of 7,000 people who actually want to come here. This is despite the fact that we suddenly have a lot of the same problems that hit Russia decades ago.​
Our own life expectancy rates have begun decreasing, and for a lot of the same reasons that struck Russia: drug and alcohol abuse, poor diet, despair, pessimism, suicide, lack of social mobility, poor access to health care, high income inequality.​
Political factors are also playing a role. Native-born Americans are beginning to get bummed out by the current environment to the point of looking to relocate to other countries like France. At the same time, would-be skilled immigrant workers are looking elsewhere, to places like Canada, because of, among other things, our surging “antagonism” toward foreigners.​
Remember how Trump was so mad that so many people from “shithole” countries wanted to come here? (“Why do we need more Haitians?” he asked). Remember how he wanted more people from Norway?​
Well, people from Norway aren’t coming for the simple reason that their country does not suck, and ours increasingly does. As the Atlantic put it:​
Norway is the world’s happiest country (the U.S. ranks 14), the place with the most political freedom (the U.S. ranks 45), most press freedom (the U.S. ranks 43rd), and most prosperity (the U.S. ranks 18).
Forty-third in press freedom! Forty-fifth in political freedom! Awesome. And those numbers are sure to plummet further. Within a few years, migrant caravans will be asking for passage through the U.S. to Canada.​
Nonetheless, Trump is telling a few thousand of the dwindling number of people worldwide who actually want to come to our crumbling idiot’s paradise to turn around and go home.​
A generation ago, Russia and America were the world’s only hegemonic powers. Now we are inarguably both in decline, although we’re taking very different approaches to facing that reality. Perhaps our two nations could help each other.............................................................................................​
The main lesson in all of this: If we want to keep foreigners out of America, we probably don’t need to take drastic steps of any kind. Just being ourselves will be deterrent enough. Once we reach the stage of being a heavily armed, paranoid ex-superpower whose citizens are more likely to overdose out of self-loathing than reproduce — Russia’s already been through this, and we’re pretty much there — people will stop coming on their own.​
Russia’s Biggest Problem Will Soon Be Ours – Rolling Stone
You make a good argument but as long as wildlife is threatened by what we are doing to the planet, I will say we need to reduce our numbers. I grew up in LA and that much humanity is not a good thing, and it is my understanding that major cities around the world have even greater human density. Such dense populations, along with the destruction of nature, is dehumanizing and many problems spin out of that. I will stand on the argument that we must limit our numbers to live in harmony with nature.
 

imaginethat

Forum Staff
Oct 2010
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Colorado
You are more than welcome to show where what I said was incorrect at anytime, in this thread, by bringing to light, any reference to a nation besides the USA involved in CA and SA nations before I mentioned the Soviet influence.
US influence considerably predates the Soviet influence.

The US' "colonial" attitude towards CA created the opening for the Soviets.

That attitude continues, and it's one of the drivers of illegal immigration.
 
Likes: Hollywood
Feb 2014
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US influence considerably predates the Soviet influence.

The US' "colonial" attitude towards CA created the opening for the Soviets.

That attitude continues, and it's one of the drivers of illegal immigration.
You lost me on that one and I don't have time to study the thread and figure it out. US influence on what? What is CA? What is the attitude?

PS I like your Elvis quote.
 
Dec 2016
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Canada
You make a good argument but as long as wildlife is threatened by what we are doing to the planet, I will say we need to reduce our numbers. I grew up in LA and that much humanity is not a good thing, and it is my understanding that major cities around the world have even greater human density. Such dense populations, along with the destruction of nature, is dehumanizing and many problems spin out of that. I will stand on the argument that we must limit our numbers to live in harmony with nature.
That's true, but the big difference is not the body count, it's how the people live! How much energy and resources they use and consume! So, I imagine LA is much like what has happened here in the Niagara Peninsula in the past 20 years...as new immigrants find the big cities like Toronto already too overcrowded, too hard to get around in...even with public transit, and much too expensive...with real estate prices soaring. So developers in surrounding areas that are within a 2 hour highway commute (real estate agents always give prospective buyers the most optimal numbers for drive time) have no doubt, bought off mayors and local city and regional councilors to rubberstamp all their suburban developments....many of which are going right in previously protected forests and wetlands, to buy $500,000 homes that they consider a bargain compared to what Toronto and the immediate Toronto area is asking!

So, urban development has required cutting down more and more trees-- cutting wildlife populations and forcing them into smaller and more isolated enclaves. And, of course they all need cars! Just as I did when I wanted to stay in our hometown and drive 50 miles to work every day. It's a toxic setup that I'm glad I was able to escape from by moving close to work....in a neighborhood that was not popular about 18 years ago! And this is Not how most people living in the tropic zone have lived...at least up until transnational capitalists have invaded their homelands with foreign buyers starting cash-cropping ventures and new, low wage industry in the cities.

Whatever happens, the demographic trends all over the world indicate that the 'population explosion' was a temporary crisis caused by the sudden cut in infant death rates in societies which still were geared towards high birth rates to ensure a family would have enough children to carry on and look after their elders late in life. World populations will decline gradually after the middle of this century (if we were actually doing something about climate change and destruction of wild habitats) OR it will happen fast in population crashes, because of the sudden declines in food-especially grain production that will happen as more and more prime grain-growing regions in the world have depleted their soil and mined phosphates (essential for artificial fertilizer production) are almost gone also.
 
Dec 2016
3,672
1,896
Canada
For the last fucking time, until I mentioned it, not one time did you even pretend to act like there was any other nation involved in South American or Central American influence but the USA. You absolutely did place all the blame on the USA. Every bit of it, until I called you out.
Sincerely
Done
If he won't place all the blame on the USA I will! Because, like it or lump it, the United States is the global enforcer and headquarters for most of the transnational capitalist class that actually run this world!
So congratulations, you guys are the fucking enforcers for the global banking and asset management empire that the vast majority of Americans receive scant financial benefits from....while being stuck with a growing pile of debts piling up to support the largest government bureaucracy in the world: The Military-Industrial Complex! Enjoy!
 
Likes: Hollywood

imaginethat

Forum Staff
Oct 2010
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24,653
Colorado
You lost me on that one and I don't have time to study the thread and figure it out. US influence on what? What is CA? What is the attitude?

PS I like your Elvis quote.
Central America. The attitude is and has been that the land and people have been exploited by US business interests and "protected" by the US military for a long time, far before any Soviet influence in the region, and more.

This exploitative attitude paved the way for folks like Che, and Ortega.