Russia is found guilty of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 crash

Apr 2019
1
0
Britain
#1
MH17.jpg
On July 2019, it is 5 years anniversary since Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 crash in the sky over the Ukrainian region Donbass. For these years’ large work of the Joint Investigation Team (JIT) has been carried out (done by representatives of Australia, the Netherlands, and Malaysia) — results of private investigations were published, hundreds of opinions on guilt or innocence of these or those persons in destruction of a civil airliner were written.

In the run-up to this mournful anniversary a visit of Stef Blok, the Minister of the Foreign Affairs of the Netherlands, to Australia and Malaysia is remarkable. Therefore, on March 27 Mr. Blok during a joint press conference with the Australian colleague Maris Payne noted an indisputable guilt of the Russian Federation in destruction of Malaysia Airlines flight MH17. Moreover, he underlined that governments of two countries are convinced of the need for establishment the truth regardless of political or economic conjuncture.

Next day, on March 28, the Foreign Minister of the Netherlands visited Malaysia and discussed the question on further work of the JIT on the issue of MH-17 crash together with economic and financial problems.

Both during visit to Australia and negotiations with the Malaysian colleague Dato Saifuddin Abdullah, Mr. Blok evaded the questions of journalists concerning further course of investigation of the crash and punishment of those responsible. Let’s allow to assume that similar restraint is a tribute to impartial justice. According to the common decision of the Netherlands, Australia and Malaysia trial in the issue of the flight MH17 will be carried out in the Netherlands and therefore many significant details are not subject to disclosure in the interests of the investigation and impartiality of the future court. There is, however, no uncertainty in this issue — the JIT studied carefully the place of the flight crash, carried out complex of specialized examinations, including a type of rocket that struck a civil airliner. Numerous attempts of the Russian diplomats to declare murder of nearly 300 citizens of the different countries as provocation of Ukraine were completely disproved by the JIT. Moreover, Russian ownership of that ‘Buk’ surface-to-air missile system from which the Boeing had been brought down was established.

Therefore, attempts of the Russian Federation to start secret negotiations on compensations and other options of settlement of criminal trial in the matter of the Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 do not make sense. When responsible for the tragedy is obvious, for a civilized society price of a compromise is too high.
In summary, it should be noted that specific performers — operators and commanders of ‘Buk’ — would be punished eventually. Taking into account the international resonance of the tragedy MH17 it is inevitable.

The terrorist state, which is capable to destroy civil planes for achievement of the geopolitical purposes, has to be also punished.
 
Oct 2010
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Colorado
#2
Whether Russia planned and carried out the downing of MH17, Russia indeed did create the circumstances that led to the downing and deaths of almost 300 civilian passengers and crew. Russian involvement was evident almost from day one. I will watch this closely.
 
Likes: Hollywood
Sep 2017
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#3
Whether Russia planned and carried out the downing of MH17, Russia indeed did create the circumstances that led to the downing and deaths of almost 300 civilian passengers and crew. Russian involvement was evident almost from day one. I will watch this closely.
Russian apologists and trolls are still trying to push the Ukrainian Su-25 theory even though Sukhoi themselves says that it cannot reach that altitude with a weapon load.

Amusing how they claimed no Russian military in Crimea even when they had an actual naval and an army base there, and the same regarding Eastern Ukraine even as we were watching Russian POW's and military funerals back in Russia.
 
Oct 2010
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Colorado
#4
Russian apologists and trolls are still trying to push the Ukrainian Su-25 theory even though Sukhoi themselves says that it cannot reach that altitude with a weapon load.

Amusing how they claimed no Russian military in Crimea even when they had an actual naval and an army base there, and the same regarding Eastern Ukraine even as we watching watching Russian POW's and military funerals back in Russia.
On the ground, right with it, right as it was happening.

 
Dec 2016
4,812
2,472
Canada
#6
Whether Russia planned and carried out the downing of MH17, Russia indeed did create the circumstances that led to the downing and deaths of almost 300 civilian passengers and crew. Russian involvement was evident almost from day one. I will watch this closely.
Why was commercial air traffic being routed through an ongoing conflict zone where combattants on both sides were known to have missiles?
 
Likes: Sabcat
Dec 2016
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#7
Russian apologists and trolls are still trying to push the Ukrainian Su-25 theory even though Sukhoi themselves says that it cannot reach that altitude with a weapon load.

Amusing how they claimed no Russian military in Crimea even when they had an actual naval and an army base there, and the same regarding Eastern Ukraine even as we watching watching Russian POW's and military funerals back in Russia.
If I was a Russian....and I'm basing this on a couple of sources who left their homeland in the 90's, and expected to go back as the Cold War was supposed to be over, there is no damn way I would have accepted destabilizing neighboring countries with large Russian ethnic populations. Let's not forget that during the height of the Donbass civil war, there were more than 800,000 Eastern Ukraine refugees who fled into Russia! What would the US have done in a similar situation on its borders? It's not hard to imagine the way white wing Americans are in a total freakout about penniless refugees from the south trying to get across their border!
 
Sep 2017
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#8
Why was commercial air traffic being routed through an ongoing conflict zone where combattants on both sides were known to have missiles?
No side was supposed to have any ground- to-air missiles that can reach the altitude that the commercial traffic was routed to. On paper the Ukrainians had some Buk's, but like the bulk their MiG-29's they were inoperable. In fact, nearly all their Mi-29's were captured by Russia and they still claimed not to be participating in the war. The Buk's that Ukraine has now were not modernized and brought to operation status until starting in 2016. That was why everyone pointed the finger at Russia immediately, but they came up with a bullshit theory that NO ONE believed except for Russian apologists and trolls. No one thought that Ukraine would launch any GTA missiles because the separatists had nothing in the air for the Ukrainians to shoot at and there was nothing workable for them to capture from the Ukrainians.

Unfortunately for Russia, she is not as smart as she think she is - note that they can't even kill an old man and his daughter without their two goons being captured on film all over the place with the appropriate time stamps. You can't deploy a weapon that has no plausible denial if no one but you have it at the time in the area. The West was able to triangulate the exact locations of the three vehicle of the Buk unit - the radar vehicle. the launch vehicle, and the load vehicle. With satellite imagery, we also found and identified their track prints and route back to Russia after their Oops Moment. They also forgot to tell their separatist buddies not be brag on social media.

If I was a Russian....and I'm basing this on a couple of sources who left their homeland in the 90's, and expected to go back as the Cold War was supposed to be over, there is no damn way I would have accepted destabilizing neighboring countries with large Russian ethnic populations. Let's not forget that during the height of the Donbass civil war, there were more than 800,000 Eastern Ukraine refugees who fled into Russia! What would the US have done in a similar situation on its borders? It's not hard to imagine the way white wing Americans are in a total freakout about penniless refugees from the south trying to get across their border!
Then you don't really understand Russians. It is an identity, not a nationality. They have demonstrated this by offering anyone of Russian ethnicity a visa and full Russian citizenship just to have pretext for land grab/invasion or to reunite "historical Russian lands" with the Motherland. Problem again is that Russia is not that smart and is giving precedent to claims by others. The Chinese Dragon has awoken and when fully fed, will reclaim what she feels rightfully belongs to her. Starting with Outer Mongolia, then Vladivostok, and then Siberia. General Winter only works against Europeans. Asiatics prefer to fight during winter.
 
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Dec 2016
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#9
No side was supposed to have any ground- to-air missiles that can reach the altitude that the commercial traffic was routed to. On paper the Ukrainians had some Buk's, but like the bulk their MiG-29's they were inoperable. In fact, nearly all their MiG=29 were captured by Russia and they still claimed not to be participating the war. The Buk's that Ukraine has now were not modernized and brought to operation status starting in 2016. That was why everyone pointed the finger at Russia immediately, but they came up with a bullshit theory that NO ONE believed except for Russian apologists and trolls. No one thought that Ukraine would launch any GTA missiles because the separatists had nothing in the air for the Ukrainians to shoot at and there was nothing workable for them to capture from the Ukrainians.
And so both sides were taken at their word that they would not fire any missiles that could fly high enough to take out a commercial airliner? Were the people on board all of the flights that were going over Eastern Ukraine even aware that they were flying over a war zone? How many passengers would have been okay with it if they knew? Would you have flown over there before MH-17 before it was shot down?

I don't intend to spend time on this story since there really isn't anything new since the official report three years ago by the Dutch/Australian investigations team. But I found this of interest on the MH-17 Wikipedia page:
Some airlines started to avoid eastern Ukrainian airspace in early March 2014 due to safety concerns.[47][48] In April, the International Civil Aviation Organization warned governments that there was a risk to commercial passenger flights over south-eastern Ukraine.[7]:217 The American Federal Aviation Administration issued restrictions on flights over Crimea, to the south of MH17's route, and advised airlines flying over some other parts of Ukraine to "exercise extreme caution". This warning did not include the MH17 crash region.[49][50] 37 airlines continued overflying eastern Ukraine and about 900 flights crossed the Donetsk region in the seven days before the Boeing 777 was shot down.[51]
And as I understand, the Eastern rebels did not have any aircraft and Russia wasn't flying their fighter jets over the region, so it would be more likely for obvious reasons that anti-aircraft missiles would be fired by the rebels than the western Ukraine Government that was free to fly about except for the risk of missiles and anti-aircraft guns.
Unfortunately for Russia, she is not as smart as she think she is - note that they can't even kill an old man and his daughter without their two goons being captured on film all over the place with the appropriate time stamps. You can't deploy a weapon that has no plausible denial if no one but you have it at the time in the area. The West was able to triangulate the exact locations of the three vehicle of the Buk unit - the radar vehicle. the launch vehicle, and the load vehicle. With satellite imagery, we also found and identified their track prints and route back to Russia after their Oops Moment. They also forgot to tell their separatist buddies not be brag on social media.
So, why not just throw crap at the wall! What has the Skripal poisonings by the world's most deadly lethal nerve agent....which failed to kill them got to do with the Malaysian airliner? Except maybe that as last I recall reading anything on it, the British Government never supplied anything close to physical evidence of what exactly this nerve agent was...like it's chemical signature, and why...if it was lethal, it failed to kill their intended targets. Nor have they explained how two completely unrelated Brits were poisoned...one did die a year after, or what connection Porton Down has with these incidents! The two Russians were photographed nowhere near the Skripal's home...you forgot to mention that part! The cctv pictures of two Russians are from Gatwick Airport, a downtown street in the town of Salisbury and the Salisbury train station. I don't know what they were all about...but the theory that they are two gay Russian men who went on vacation in a more gay-friendly country is at least as possible as telling us that they had a top secret-but unidentified poison and smeared the Skripal's front door with it to try to contaminate them with it....let alone why this supposedly fast decaying poison was able to be left in a sample that could kill others a year later....and after the British authorities declared there was no danger to the public from 'novichok' poisoning.

Then you don't really understand Russians. It is an identity, not a nationality. They have demonstrated this by offering anyone of Russian ethnicity a visa and full Russian citizenship just to have pretext for land grab/invasion or to reunite "historical Russian lands" with the Motherland. Problem again is that Russia is not that smart and is giving precedent to claims by others. .
It is a multitude of ethnicities actually, that are bound together by a common language and religious affiliation, and that's it! Joseph Stalin ordered the abandoning of the original communist goal of internationalism - an international working class of all races, languages and ethnicities bound by the common purpose of overthrowing local ruling classes and achieving worker control of the political and economic infrastructure. Stalin....who wasn't a Russian either for that matter, since he was a Georgian, demanded a change called Russification of the USSR, and wanted all of the Soviet Republics to adopt the Russian language as the primary language above local languages and dialects.
The Chinese Dragon has awoken and when fully fed, will reclaim her what she feels rightfully belongs to her. Starting with Outer Mongolia, then Vladivostok, and then Siberia. General Winter only works against Europeans. Asiatics prefer to fight during winter
More of this shit! Did you find some reds under your bed this morning?
Because of stupid and greedy US geopolitics especially since Bush One, the old Nixonian/Kissinger strategy of dividing the communist menace through alliance with China has gone up in flames under Trump! Because of US hostility to China's economic success...it was intended that China become a capitalist supplier of cheap labor for cheap manufacturing/not an economic rival...the threat of US hegemony has been driving Russia and China back together for the past 20 years. They are working out their border disputes in Mongolia and Siberia, and trade...including military is on the increase, and China has doubled its military spending in the past 6 or 8 years, to try to develop the forces necessary to protect territorial waters they claim and more important -- to push back or fight back against US regime change tactics that have been brought in to African nations where China has set up trade agreements only to see everything turned upside down by regime changes run by US forces, either overtly as in Libya, or covertly in the rest of the Continent. The American Empire is the one that has to fear the "Chinese Dragon," not Russia, which cannot move past being a middle power and has a better strategy working with China rather than trying to displace them.
 
Likes: Sabcat
Oct 2010
66,115
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Colorado
#10
Why was commercial air traffic being routed through an ongoing conflict zone where combattants on both sides were known to have missiles?
Economics, evidently.

THE news that a passenger jet had been shot down on July 17th, apparently following the bungled targeting of a surface-to-air missile, was met with horror. Along with many other questions about the tragedy, some have wondered what Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 was doing flying over eastern Ukraine, which has been the setting of a low-intensity war for several months. Since the downing of MH17, commercial jets have steered clear of Ukraine (as can be seen on flight-tracking websites such as flightradar24, pictured). But how often do passenger planes normally fly over war zones? And how risky is it?​
Taking a detour to avoid an area of conflict means spending more time in the air, burning more fuel. So airlines go direct if they consider it safe. Malaysia Airlines was not the only operator crossing eastern Ukraine at the time of the tragedy. L980, the route in question, was the flight path chosen by many passenger jets travelling between the big cities of Europe and South Asia. In fact, wars usually have little impact on commercial flights. As fighting raged in Afghanistan, for instance, in the skies above it was mostly business as usual for the world’s airlines.​

Why was MH17, a civilian airliner, flying over a war zone?

The doomed Boeing 777 was following an air traffic routing between Europe and Asia that is issued by dozens of jets a day and was in a section of air space deemed safe by international aviation authorities.​
Within hours of Thursday’s disaster, all air space around eastern Ukraine was shut down. But some airlines had already been avoiding the area amid concerns over the deteriorating security. Two low-flying Ukrainian aircraft—a fighter jet and a military transport plane—were shot down by pro-separatist rebels earlier this week.​
Aviation regulators—including the FAA—had issued a series of notices to pilots in recent weeks prohibiting air space very close to the crash site.​
“This was a very commonly used route and passenger jets fly at high altitudes over many of the world’s hotspots all the time,” said Norman Shanks, professor of aviation security at Britain’s Coventry University. “They chose the most direct and economic flight route possible, which keeps their fuel costs down and is something we expect as customers. They were no different from any other international airline.”​

Why was Malaysia Airlines MH17 flying over Ukraine?
 
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