Socialism has always had the same format.

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Saudi Arabia is a whole ass welfare state, not that different from Venezuela. They’re just American backed.
Well with that oil money supporting government, of course they're a welfare state. They just not working to create socialism as Venezuela is.
 
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You could say the same about capitalism
What you, or anyone, can say about capitalism is that when combined with democracy no two institutions have done more to improve the human condition throughout human history.
 
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What you, or anyone, can say about capitalism is that when combined with democracy no two institutions have done more to improve the human condition throughout human history.
Debatable. While poverty rates have decreased in a lot of places, these results have been highly uneven.

Capitalism is pretty much a failure everywhere that isn’t the West. It created a lot of inequities.

It’s been an abysmal failure in places like Africa, Latin America, etc. Whereas socialism is highly successful in places like China, the USSR, Scandinavia, and it was certainly successful in Venezuela for a while.


Democracy has been a failure everywhere that isn’t the West as well tbh. Many cultures quite frankly aren’t capitalistic or democratic by nature and require governments that better serve them, and in many cases, these are dictatorships.

A Chinese person once explained to me how Chinese people don’t really care about democracy because of how fragmented and unstable China has been throughout history, and how they prefer the stability they have now. A little less than a century ago, China was a backwater that was ruled by warlords and foreign powers. Taking these things into account, Chinese ppl simply don’t care about things like rights and democracy; they’re more concerned about structure and stability, and the CCP provides that.
 
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Debatable. While poverty rates have decreased in a lot of places, these results have been highly uneven.

Capitalism is pretty much a failure everywhere that isn’t the West. It created a lot of inequities.

It’s been an abysmal failure in places like Africa, Latin America, etc. Whereas socialism is highly successful in places like China, the USSR, and it was certainly successful in Venezuela for a while.
How many millions more would have had to die in the Soviet system before you would question its brand of highly successful socialism?
 
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How many millions more would have had to dye in the Soviet system before you would question its brand of highly successful socialism?
A lot of the deaths that occurred under the Soviet system were due to war, famine, and government repression. Socialism itself didn’t kill these people. You can make the argument that socialism was the engine that drove the actions of ppl like Stalin but then you’d have to agree that capitalism is responsible for slavery, imperialism, mental illness, drug addiction, obesity, etc.

It’s also worth noting that many of the people who were killed in places like Cuba, the Soviet Union were class enemies who were members of the old regimes. Once I learned about the history of pre-Castro Cuba, I found it very hard to have sympathy for the wealthy elite who fled to Florida when Castro took over.
 
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A lot of the deaths that occurred under the Soviet system were due to war, famine, and government repression. Socialism itself didn’t kill these people. You can make the argument that socialism was the engine that drove the actions of ppl like Stalin but then you’d have to agree that capitalism is responsible for slavery, imperialism, mental illness, drug addiction, obesity, etc.
The argument I make is that the concentration of political power necessary to implement socialism is what leads to the famine, repression, and human misery we see under socialist systems. They are two sides of the same coin. The USSR had no shortage of slave labor, imperialism, and human suffering of the kind you describe. Though I'll cede one point. Obesity tended to be scarce owed to a lack of available food for anyone not well connected to The State.

Capitalism need not be perfect to be a better choice than socialism. It just needs to produce better results, and it does.
 
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