The Arctic's 'last bastion' of sea ice is breaking up for the first time on record

Jun 2013
28,864
15,441
Ohio
#32
Like I said, you're a fucking idiot who pretends to have and respect scientific knowledge.

I'm finished responding to the same tired bullshit you ejaculate in every climate discussion.
Agreed

WW2 Munitions are blowing up in that massive Berlin forest fire
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...o-shut-windows-forest-fires-smoke-brandenburg
<snip>

Berlin residents have been told to shut windows and doors after a large forest fire sent a giant plume of smoke across the city, with unexploded munitions from the second world war complicating firefighting efforts.

The blaze, which began on Thursday afternoon, spread quickly overnight to engulf 400 hectares (1,000 acres) of forest between the Brandenburg town of Treuenbrietzen and village of Jüterborg, 39 miles (63km) south-west of the German capital.

Flames lit up the forest as fire crews deployed water cannon and joined helicopters, army and police officers in an attempt to control the inferno.

A fire brigade spokesman told the newspaper Bild: “We can’t get to a lot of places, only the paths that have been cleared and are accessible.”
 
Likes: imaginethat
Mar 2013
9,211
9,937
Middle Tennessee
#33
When I was in high school EVERY text book I read and several articles in magazines ALL SAID that based on historical weather patterns we were HEADED INTO A NEW MINI ICE AGE. That the late 1800s and very early 1900s were the end of a thousand year cycle AND a smaller 100 year cycle. That we'd see some what less violent weather for a couple of decades followed by a slow cooling trend into the 21 century. That was accepted as scientific fact back then. So what happened ? and Where did all of this contradictory information about natural warming trends come from ??
 
Likes: imaginethat
Apr 2013
35,897
24,389
Left coast
#34
When I was in high school EVERY text book I read and several articles in magazines ALL SAID that based on historical weather patterns we were HEADED INTO A NEW MINI ICE AGE. That the late 1800s and very early 1900s were the end of a thousand year cycle AND a smaller 100 year cycle. That we'd see some what less violent weather for a couple of decades followed by a slow cooling trend into the 21 century. That was accepted as scientific fact back then. So what happened ? and Where did all of this contradictory information about natural warming trends come from ??
You already know.;)
 
Oct 2010
65,520
26,119
Colorado
#36
When I was in high school EVERY text book I read and several articles in magazines ALL SAID that based on historical weather patterns we were HEADED INTO A NEW MINI ICE AGE. That the late 1800s and very early 1900s were the end of a thousand year cycle AND a smaller 100 year cycle. That we'd see some what less violent weather for a couple of decades followed by a slow cooling trend into the 21 century. That was accepted as scientific fact back then. So what happened ? and Where did all of this contradictory information about natural warming trends come from ??
Yes, the "natural" direction the climate appeared to be taking was interrupted by humans taking carbon sequestered underground and releasing it into the atmosphere.

The climate is delicately balanced. Fool TNV makes the foolish observation that water vapor is the "major" heat-retentive gas. On the surface that is true, however, it's a given and may be factored out of climatic analysis.

The melting of permafrost and the accompanying release of methane may not be factored out. Read this and weep:

Sea ice loss is correlated with warming of Northern latitudes. This has melting effects on permafrost, both in the sea,[23]and on land.[24] Lawrence et al. suggest that current rapid melting of the sea ice may induce a rapid melting of arctic permafrost.[24][25] This has consequential effects on methane release,[3] and wildlife.[24] Some studies imply a direct link, as they predict cold air passing over ice is replaced by warm air passing over the sea. This warm air carries heat to the permafrost around the Arctic, and melts it.[24] This permafrost then releases huge quantities of methane.[26]Methane release can be gaseous, but is also transported in solution by rivers.[5] New Scientist states that "Since existing models do not include feedback effects such as the heat generated by decomposition, the permafrost could melt far faster than generally thought."[27]

There is another possible mechanism for rapid methane release. As the Arctic Ocean becomes more and more ice free, the ocean absorbs more of the incident energy from the sun. The Arctic Ocean becomes warmer than the former ice cover and much more water vapour enters the air. At times when the adjacent land is colder than the sea, this causes rising air above the sea and an off-shore wind as air over the land comes in to replace the rising air over the sea. As the air rises, the dew point is reached and clouds form, releasing latent heat and further reinforcing the buoyancy of the air over the ocean. All this results in air being drawn from the south across the tundra rather than the present situation of cold air flowing toward the south from the cold sinking air over the Arctic Ocean. The extra heat being drawn from the south further accelerates the warming of the permafrost and the Arctic Ocean with increased release of methane.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arctic_methane_emissions#Loss_of_permafrost

I always thought climate change would be something my children and grandchildren would deal with rather than me. I now know that's not right. Climate change isn't some future event that may happen.

It's happening now, and the rate of change is accelerating.
 
Nov 2012
39,952
11,573
Lebanon, TN
#37
Yes, the "natural" direction the climate appeared to be taking was interrupted by humans taking carbon sequestered underground and releasing it into the atmosphere.

The climate is delicately balanced. Fool TNV makes the foolish observation that water vapor is the "major" heat-retentive gas. On the surface that is true, however, it's a given and may be factored out of climatic analysis.

The melting of permafrost and the accompanying release of methane may not be factored out. Read this and weep:

Sea ice loss is correlated with warming of Northern latitudes. This has melting effects on permafrost, both in the sea,[23]and on land.[24] Lawrence et al. suggest that current rapid melting of the sea ice may induce a rapid melting of arctic permafrost.[24][25] This has consequential effects on methane release,[3] and wildlife.[24] Some studies imply a direct link, as they predict cold air passing over ice is replaced by warm air passing over the sea. This warm air carries heat to the permafrost around the Arctic, and melts it.[24] This permafrost then releases huge quantities of methane.[26]Methane release can be gaseous, but is also transported in solution by rivers.[5] New Scientist states that "Since existing models do not include feedback effects such as the heat generated by decomposition, the permafrost could melt far faster than generally thought."[27]

There is another possible mechanism for rapid methane release. As the Arctic Ocean becomes more and more ice free, the ocean absorbs more of the incident energy from the sun. The Arctic Ocean becomes warmer than the former ice cover and much more water vapour enters the air. At times when the adjacent land is colder than the sea, this causes rising air above the sea and an off-shore wind as air over the land comes in to replace the rising air over the sea. As the air rises, the dew point is reached and clouds form, releasing latent heat and further reinforcing the buoyancy of the air over the ocean. All this results in air being drawn from the south across the tundra rather than the present situation of cold air flowing toward the south from the cold sinking air over the Arctic Ocean. The extra heat being drawn from the south further accelerates the warming of the permafrost and the Arctic Ocean with increased release of methane.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arctic_methane_emissions#Loss_of_permafrost

I always thought climate change would be something my children and grandchildren would deal with rather than me. I now know that's not right. Climate change isn't some future event that may happen.

It's happening now, and the rate of change is accelerating.

what % of CO2, H2O vapor, and CH3 gasses are emissions natural.

~97%-98%
 
Oct 2010
65,520
26,119
Colorado
#38
what % of CO2, H2O vapor, and CH3 gasses are emissions natural.

~97%-98%
Immaterial and irrelevant. Fossil carbon is being added to the atmosphere at the rate of 2.4 million pounds of carbon dioxide per second.

The changes we are seeing in non-geologic time scales are not "normal" climatic fluctuations. I have no idea how a person who is honest with himself or herself can shield themselves from a growing body of evidence that big changes are afoot.

You , objectively speaking, have rendered yourself immune to our continuing expansion of observational knowledge combined with ongoing refinements of the relatively new science of climatology.

The water content of the atmosphere has no bearing on the ongoing and accelerating non-geologic timescale additions of CO2, CH4, and host of other heat-retentive gases to our atmosphere. The earth has natural climatic variations, true, but right now in the 21st century that fact is absolutely immaterial and irrelevant to what currently is going on.

The fact that water vapor is a heat-retentive gas likewise is immaterial and irrelevant. Water vapor content is a constant that factors out.

Even though we are observing changes, increasingly dramatic and in agreement with our ever-improving understanding of climatology, in the climate, you continue to spout the paranoid "explanations" hatched by the same people who argued into the '90s that the so-called harmful effects of tobacco were mere speculation.

While science has moved, you have not, and I'm pissed off at you and all of you who prevented action being taken to reduce humanity's and our nation's carbon footprint, such as the damned removal of the White House solar panels. I'm pissed off at you for your tireless efforts to ensure that the US is not the leader to a more sane future not based on fire

You reject the observed warming while you accept the abomination called Trump. Clearly, for you the love of money and the fear of losing it are more important than passing on a better world to our children and grandchildren.

Every time I look at my grandchildren I think of the stupidity and paranoia of people like you.
 
Nov 2012
39,952
11,573
Lebanon, TN
#39
what % of CO2, H2O vapor, and CH3 gasses are emissions natural.

~97%-98%
Immaterial and irrelevant. Fossil carbon is being added to the atmosphere at the rate of 2.4 million pounds of carbon dioxide per second.

The changes we are seeing in non-geologic time scales are not "normal" climatic fluctuations. I have no idea how a person who is honest with himself or herself can shield themselves from a growing body of evidence that big changes are afoot.

You , objectively speaking, have rendered yourself immune to our continuing expansion of observational knowledge combined with ongoing refinements of the relatively new science of climatology.

The water content of the atmosphere has no bearing on the ongoing and accelerating non-geologic timescale additions of CO2, CH4, and host of other heat-retentive gases to our atmosphere. The earth has natural climatic variations, true, but right now in the 21st century that fact is absolutely immaterial and irrelevant to what currently is going on.

The fact that water vapor is a heat-retentive gas likewise is immaterial and irrelevant. Water vapor content is a constant that factors out.

Even though we are observing changes, increasingly dramatic and in agreement with our ever-improving understanding of climatology, in the climate, you continue to spout the paranoid "explanations" hatched by the same people who argued into the '90s that the so-called harmful effects of tobacco were mere speculation.

While science has moved, you have not, and I'm pissed off at you and all of you who prevented action being taken to reduce humanity's and our nation's carbon footprint, such as the damned removal of the White House solar panels. I'm pissed off at you for your tireless efforts to ensure that the US is not the leader to a more sane future not based on fire

You reject the observed warming while you accept the abomination called Trump. Clearly, for you the love of money and the fear of losing it are more important than passing on a better world to our children and grandchildren.

Every time I look at my grandchildren I think of the stupidity and paranoia of people like you.

Yes they are actually Carbon dioxide levels are lower than in the previous 4 warming periods. (no man made contribution)
 
Oct 2010
65,520
26,119
Colorado
#40
Yes they are actually Carbon dioxide levels are lower than in the previous 4 warming periods. (no man made contribution)
When all else fails, resort to falsehoods, eh?

You're wrong, actually, as usual.



Every time I look at my grandchildren I think of the stupidity and paranoia of people like you.
 
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