Why Doesn't the "right" go into education

Dec 2015
17,911
17,004
Arizona
This is awesome. It is explained in the first few minutes




The creation of mathbot.

This one is for you Clara

Hey! Thanks for thinking of me. Not sure what the title of the thread has to do with Common Core math, but okay.
A lot of educators are not thrilled with Common Core State Standards--for all sorts of reasons---but we all agree that state standards are necessary--and let's remember that standards are NOT curriculum. They are NOT lesson plans. State Standards are a series of standards that each lesson needs to align to in order to make sure teachers are teaching something with academic value (basically, if I can’t explain why it should be in the classroom, I shouldn’t be teaching it). It is almost the exact same as the old system, NCLB, but with cleaner, better written standards. Students are required to be adept at grade level standards by the end of the school year to progress to the next level--the next grade. Inventing a new game or a new software does NOT change the state standard. It changes the method of instruction and Mr. Weatherman is welcome (in fact encouraged) to create innovative ways to get kids excited about math.
The question asked should be "what is the real purpose behind CC math"? The answer is in the WHY and Mr. Weatherman addresses the WHY when he mentions 'why make math complicated when it should be simple'. BOOM! Exactly and here's where we separate the educators from the flock. WHY make it complex?
With the traditional way, numbers are fixed. Calculation is mechanical. You don’t really need to understand what you’re doing or why you’re doing it. Just memorize, carry the 1, and continue by rote.
The problem is that when the Common Core approach is written out, it looks horribly complex. It looks like more work than the traditional way. It looks more complicated than when it’s done in the head, but that's the point. Why does 3 x 5=15? How can we manipulate those numbers? Why is it important that we understand the fluidity of numbers? Students must be able to explain HOW they got the right answer and show their work by breaking it down. This is not a new concept. It's called critical thinking. Teachers want to know IF the student truly understands the WHY and the HOW--not just the answer.
More than likely you are intrigued with the idea of the bit coin pay-off in the Mathbot model, but how practical is that for public schools? Dozens of kids at a time?
I'm certainly willing to consider the software, but let's remember the creator is hawking a new product. He's a salesman. Not a teacher.
 
Dec 2013
33,811
19,362
Beware of watermelons
Hey! Thanks for thinking of me. Not sure what the title of the thread has to do with Common Core math, but okay.
A lot of educators are not thrilled with Common Core State Standards--for all sorts of reasons---but we all agree that state standards are necessary--and let's remember that standards are NOT curriculum. They are NOT lesson plans. State Standards are a series of standards that each lesson needs to align to in order to make sure teachers are teaching something with academic value (basically, if I can’t explain why it should be in the classroom, I shouldn’t be teaching it). It is almost the exact same as the old system, NCLB, but with cleaner, better written standards. Students are required to be adept at grade level standards by the end of the school year to progress to the next level--the next grade. Inventing a new game or a new software does NOT change the state standard. It changes the method of instruction and Mr. Weatherman is welcome (in fact encouraged) to create innovative ways to get kids excited about math.
The question asked should be "what is the real purpose behind CC math"? The answer is in the WHY and Mr. Weatherman addresses the WHY when he mentions 'why make math complicated when it should be simple'. BOOM! Exactly and here's where we separate the educators from the flock. WHY make it complex?
With the traditional way, numbers are fixed. Calculation is mechanical. You don’t really need to understand what you’re doing or why you’re doing it. Just memorize, carry the 1, and continue by rote.
The problem is that when the Common Core approach is written out, it looks horribly complex. It looks like more work than the traditional way. It looks more complicated than when it’s done in the head, but that's the point. Why does 3 x 5=15? How can we manipulate those numbers? Why is it important that we understand the fluidity of numbers? Students must be able to explain HOW they got the right answer and show their work by breaking it down. This is not a new concept. It's called critical thinking. Teachers want to know IF the student truly understands the WHY and the HOW--not just the answer.
More than likely you are intrigued with the idea of the bit coin pay-off in the Mathbot model, but how practical is that for public schools? Dozens of kids at a time?
I'm certainly willing to consider the software, but let's remember the creator is hawking a new product. He's a salesman. Not a teacher.

Have you tried to do the common core mathematics? It is ridiculous and Minneapolis high schools adopted this insanity last year. I spent an hour or so talking w/ my kids advanced mathematics teacher. He basically said that his hands were tied. Plus they were going to make kids retake classes that they had taken outside of the school specifically geometry. By far IMO the shittiest math class ever. No test out, just do it again. Enough uproar i think it has been fixed. We will see.

The point being mathematics is a universal language and the states are intentionally fucking that up. Also, as i have been saying technology is making the public school system obsolete.

Why are kids still lugging around 200lb of text books. Because rent seeking. Why dont the schools have money. Unions. We are trying to apply a 1950s model to the modern day and this is why kids are "graduating" and still McDonald's has to put pictures on their cash registers.
 
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Dec 2015
17,911
17,004
Arizona
Have you tried to do the common core mathematics? It is ridiculous and Minneapolis high schools adopted this insanity last year. I spent an hour or so talking w/ my kids advanced mathematics teacher. He basically said that his hands were tied. Plus they were going to make kids retake classes that they had taken outside of the school specifically geometry. By far IMO the shittiest math class ever. No test out, just do it again. Enough uproar i think it has been fixed. We will see.

The point being mathematics is a universal language and the states are intentionally fucking that up. Also, as i have been saying technology is making the public school system obsolete.

Why are kids still lugging around 200lb of text books. Because rent seeking. Why dont the schools have money. Unions. We are trying to apply a 1950s model to the modern day and this is why kids are "graduating" and still McDonald's has to put pictures on their cash registers.

I agree with some your points. If this administration doesn't LIKE Common Core, Betsy De Vos is certainly in the position to propose an alternative....but again, state standards ARE important. A lot of parents feel the same as you, but is it because of the standards or the teaching method? Math is a universal language? That's a fantastic bumper sticker but means nothing unless EVERYONE understands WHY. Rote memorization is useless unless you understand how to break down the numbers and put them back together in the right order.
Textbooks?? Rent seeking? NO!! As of 2016 39% in rural areas lacked broadband internet. Access to tablets/computers was and maybe still is a 5 to1 ratio...five students to ONE computer.
Infrastructure and technological know-how aren’t the only obstacles. Digital education resources also vary in quality, and selecting the right content can be a major challenge for schools. Teachers are very concerned about appropriate digital content. They need to research and find high quality content which aligns with the state standards. In order to find that time teachers need professional development and mentors who can guide them into the needed digital resources. Many publishing companies are moving into digital texts which is great, but again that takes time and we're not THERE yet. Eventually I imagine textbooks will be gone completely but this is a complicated process.
Unions are NOT leaving school districts financially unstable. You know as well as I do that union membership is declining. YES the union members and leaders will "fight" for better pay, safe buildings and playgrounds and well-equipped classrooms, but I don't see HOW that leaves the school district financially crippled. In the end, the final financial decisions are made at the state and local level. Educators (unionized or not) have NO POWER at all...NONE.
 
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Nov 2012
41,152
11,840
Lebanon, TN
Those that Cant Teach.. Liberals talk a good game but cannot produce,

This is why Liberals are very charitable, when it comes to OTHER PEOPLE'S money


Conservatives are outcome based people so they produce.


Notice when it comes to charity (where people give their OWN MONEY) the highest ranked blue state is not even in the top 50% of Charitable Giving
 
Jun 2013
28,864
15,452
Ohio
Those that Cant Teach.. Liberals talk a good game but cannot produce,

This is why Liberals are very charitable, when it comes to OTHER PEOPLE'S money


Conservatives are outcome based people so they produce.


Notice when it comes to charity (where people give their OWN MONEY) the highest ranked blue state is not even in the top 50% of Charitable Giving
Yes, because red states have such a sterling educational outcome record.
 
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Dec 2017
1,720
839
USA
This is awesome. It is explained in the first few minutes




The creation of mathbot.

This one is for you Clara
@Sabcat

Yeah--everything that guy said in the first 10 minutes or so is accurate. In fact, if someone goes to Uni. for Math, it isn't until you reach the first "Intro to ____ Theory" class (which is after the Calculus sequence) that this is revealed to the student (in the absence of outside/independent study)--by which time people are literally in their early 20s rather than single digits age. It is standard for Professors to say something like, "Now that you feel like you know a bit of Math, this is where we drop the bomb that everything you have done to this point is wrong...Now, the calculations are not wrong, however the way in which the problem is approached is the antithesis to the entire spirit of Mathematics. We need to start from the ground up, learning what Maths is really all about--how it probably should have been taught to you as a kid, but wasn't, so we keep up the knowingly wrong track until the fundamentals of computational skills are taught, and then start all over the right way with the new skillset you have acquired, which will come in handy."
 
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Nov 2005
9,155
3,623
California
Those that Cant Teach.. Liberals talk a good game but cannot produce,
This is why Liberals are very charitable, when it comes to OTHER PEOPLE'S money
Conservatives are outcome based people so they produce.
Notice when it comes to charity (where people give their OWN MONEY) the highest ranked blue state is not even in the top 50% of Charitable Giving
Conservatives love their talking points. You just threw out something that has no intelligible application to the actual topic at hand.
The easiest refutation of your verbal diarrhea is to check how the red states / blue states do academically. And the blue states have you beat.
http://time.com/101697/blue-states-barack-obama-won-in-2012-are-more-educated-than-red-states/

And you're from Tennessee, right?
You're in a glass house that shouldn't be trying to throw stones on this issue.
21% of the adult population in Tennessee is at a level one literacy rate. According to the National Institute for Literacy, adults who read at Level 1 can not pick out an intersection on a map, locate two pieces of information in an article or fill out an application.​
http://www.wmcactionnews5.com/story/4429571/illiteracy-rates-high-in-our-area
 
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